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[Music]

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just hope radio for the masses headliner

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between July 8 1947 these are the air

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forces has a knob start applying there

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has been found and is now in the

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possession of the RA the game is rigged

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changed the game changer I occasionally

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think how quickly our differences

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worldwide would vanish if we were facing

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an alien threat from outside his way

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[Music]

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[Applause]

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[Music]

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[Applause]

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two black with your host Jimmy Church on

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the game changer radio network and K GRA

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Alliance

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[Music]

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you're listening to fade to black with

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jimmy touch on the game-changing network

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good evening fade to black

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the spoke radio for the messes yeah hi

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you doing it's Thursday nights February

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1st

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by the way 32 D I hit 32 days into the

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new year just 333 days look we are live

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from a bunker somewhere in downtown

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Burbank California now I would like to

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welcome everybody listening all around

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the world all across the United States

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hither and thither to and fro back and

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forth up and down east and west north

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and south far and near this is fade to

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black for kjc are the game changer

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network and k gra the planet i'm your

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host jimmy church what is cracking

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everybody how you doing are you ready

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it's Thursday

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it is fader night and the no more fake

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newsroom with Jon Rappoport

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followed by open lines the Colin numbers

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are 3 to 3 18 5 5 0 for 5 or 3 2 3 2 7 5

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9 6 9 5 Serena right Taylor is going to

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be here in a few minutes from the

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conscious life Expo tell us about some

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of the special events and tickets in

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that all of that stuff so we're going to

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do that in just a minute

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before that follow on Twitter right now

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at J Church radio at Jane Church radio

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come on follow me I'm a big big social

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media person okay well I've got a lot of

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stuff going on you know fade to black

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and Rita and our lives and busy busy

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busy and I still do the the social media

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thing you know I'm wondering I mean will

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it ever get to the point where you know

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I back off of Twitter or Facebook now I

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haven't done Instagram you know we have

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an Instagram account that's that's

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Rita's thing so I don't do i G all right

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let's go back to the phones hi you're

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live on fade to black who's calling yeah

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this is Richard Doty how you doing Jimmy

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hey Richard how are you sir

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I'm doing great you sound amazing

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you sound perfectly you sound like

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you're here in the studio underground

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[Laughter]

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Richard Richard Doty okay welcome to the

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show as you well I'm gonna say this with

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you I'm completely surprised by this and

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you already know that so there you go

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but Richard you've been talked about a

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lot on this show over the years what are

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you up to these days

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well I'm I'm just working for a couple

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different producers and trying to get

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some things produced in on the air doing

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some advising mostly with a particular

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producer I can't I can't discuss who but

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and I can't discuss really the project

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both we've been working a lot in Nevada

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filming by two weeks ago we filmed

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[Music]

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through two or three days in Nevada and

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just different sites in Nevada for an

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upcoming series so Richard

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is it okay if we speak freely yes

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absolutely okay I know that I know that

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you know that I know that you know about

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about your history in the past and and

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the the information the stories and so

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forth and and video and interviews and

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and and information and and so it's been

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in the UFO community for a very very

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very long time and there are those out

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there myself included that when we go

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through your part of our history

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you know our collective history that

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there is a very disturbing part of it

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that makes us you know feel a little

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uncomfortable little dirty and myself

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included and you were you were right in

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the middle of that heated heated area

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looking back and we can we can certainly

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talk about anything that you would like

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to talk about now but today do you feel

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any any guilt or would you go back and

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change anything when it comes to

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bennewitz or the way that things went

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down or was it just your job in the Air

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Force and you were just doing what you

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were told well going back to those days

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in the 80s I had a job to do I was

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sanctioned to do certain things missions

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based on a larger plan and they were and

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first of all let me know let me say that

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I wasn't the only person involved in

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this there's a hundred and twenty-two

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other agents that were doing what I was

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doing investigating and phenomenas UFO

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sightings UFO incidents involving Air

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Force or occurring on Air Force

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installations or in the vicinity Air

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Force installations rightly and so when

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we go back to the bennewitz internet or

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bennewitz operation I did what I was

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told to do I was something it was I was

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given a mission and I did my mission but

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a lot of what what is is spread in the

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internet isn't factual they I know I I

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heard somebody on coast-to-coast some

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some months ago talking about it saying

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how I brainwashed Paul bennewitz and

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well if anyone knew Paul bennewitz he

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was a very strict down-to-earth type of

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person and he was his own personality if

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he can understand what that means he has

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as he had his own thought pattern and

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own own reason and so I couldn't have

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convinced him to do something that he

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didn't want to do I never had to

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convince him to do anything during this

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operation he he was he was convinced

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that he was in contact with

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extraterrestrials all I had to do was go

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along with what he said and we did with

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me and some others we just said you know

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Paul if you think that's an extra

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truster you have on that screen and then

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I'm gonna believe you and and and so

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that that's all we did yeah we just we

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sat back and listened to him and he

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convinced himself that what he was doing

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what he was saying the pictures a risk

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taken involved extraterrestrials and

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when years later when I sat down with

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him after this was all over with and

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told Paul Paul listen what you were

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seeing really wasn't you yeah I couldn't

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convince some otherwise he wasn't going

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to listen to me so it was really easy an

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easy operation because he he convinced

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himself to believe into it but there was

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okay let me ask you a couple of let's

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actually clear the air right you were

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there and

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not sure if it was me that was hosting

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on coast-to-coast that night I don't

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remember a converse that conversation so

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I don't know what you're referring to

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directly but certainly that has been

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mentioned a lot over the years that that

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that's what went on but but let me ask

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you this did you go into bennewitz his

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house and move his furniture around to

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mess with them did that ever happen

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that's that's absolutely false I

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wouldn't have had permission to do that

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I mean I couldn't have unless I got some

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sort of a search warrant to do that i I

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couldn't have possibly done that and I

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didn't do that did anybody in the air

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force move furniture around in his house

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not not that I know of not that I know

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of but you have to understand that there

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was another agency intimately involved

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in this and that was a national security

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agency right they didn't coordinate what

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they were doing with us and and the

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particular incident I tell people is a

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when I was I was at Paul's house myself

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and another agent by name is Steve ad

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said we were at his house one night it

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was a rainy night in Albuquerque and

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Paul said there's somebody across the

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street in that house and the corner and

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and Paul said but the house is vacant

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there shouldn't be anybody in there so

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we we watched and we could see lights

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going on over there and we could realize

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what we were seeing or were lights on a

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camera a video camera and I understand

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this is like 1983 82 83 timeframe right

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and so and so I said you know what

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somebody somebody's recording something

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over there Paul so Steve and I went out

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I'd call a Albuquerque Police Department

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officer that I knew he arrived and he's

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parked a block away and we we came up an

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alley and we saw a vehicle parked behind

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this vacant house and so we recorded a

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license number the elbe

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police officer knock down the door

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because it was locked somebody came to

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the door we identified himself with

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federal credentials as a agent and the

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Albuquerque Police Officer who's the his

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name was Darrell turned them in he said

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you guys know each other and I looked at

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his credentials and it was national

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security agency and they said what are

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you guys doing here he said we're doing

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the same thing you're doing I said well

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we need to coordinate this he said well

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you're gonna have to coordinate with our

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supervisors and he shot the door

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and I and I APD officer and knocked on

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the door again and said hey you guys

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have permission here

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he said yeah we're renting the house and

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so so that's an example of them doing

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something that wasn't coordinated with

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us we had no idea what they were doing

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the next day I contacted the NSA

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representative on on base mm-hmm and I

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had a myself and in my supervisor went

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to their office sat down and said listen

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if you guys are doing something

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regarding this operation then we need to

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know about it and the supervisor said we

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were tell you what we we can tell you

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and they did but what we knew or I

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realized that they were doing more than

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they were telling us they were doing

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what did they say that they were doing

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Richard do you remember they were and

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they were interested in his

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communications devices how he was and

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and this isn't a secret anymore but Paul

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was actually tapping I don't know how

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exactly I'm not a I'm not a scientist

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but he was tapping into a community as

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secure communications system on Kirtland

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that was operated by the National

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Security Agency I and that's one of the

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reason we started this because NSA

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tasked us with with investigating it and

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so and I'm not sure how he did it but

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they were interested to know how he was

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doing it and whether he was working with

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anyone else right

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so that's that's why they were involved

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in it

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the famous box of pictures that he had

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in his home again we're going to refer

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to urban legend here Richard that you

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saw the pictures that he was taking and

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that's that some of these pictures

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clearly showed craft on the ground with

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you know flying saw it literally that

273
00:14:22,750 --> 00:14:18,830
was the description with legs lit up

274
00:14:25,690 --> 00:14:22,760
refueling taken off at Kirtland and that

275
00:14:27,970 --> 00:14:25,700
you saw these photographs and then after

276
00:14:29,470 --> 00:14:27,980
those photographs disappeared in the Box

277
00:14:35,340 --> 00:14:29,480
disappeared what can you tell me about

278
00:14:38,920 --> 00:14:35,350
that well yeah there's there's maybe

279
00:14:42,660 --> 00:14:38,930
five percent of that accurate that most

280
00:14:48,310 --> 00:14:42,670
of its not he had he had a box of

281
00:14:51,790 --> 00:14:48,320
photograph a day actually was a a file

282
00:14:54,160 --> 00:14:51,800
box that you could lock and he kept when

283
00:14:56,320 --> 00:14:54,170
I first met Paul going back some time

284
00:14:59,970 --> 00:14:56,330
myself and Jerry Miller well over his

285
00:15:02,500 --> 00:14:59,980
residence and we were discussing his his

286
00:15:03,880 --> 00:15:02,510
computer system he had and of course

287
00:15:06,520 --> 00:15:03,890
this is back in the 80s and he had a

288
00:15:09,760 --> 00:15:06,530
pretty sophisticated computer system and

289
00:15:13,030 --> 00:15:09,770
plus all these other electronical

290
00:15:16,380 --> 00:15:13,040
devices that he had on his roof and he

291
00:15:20,500 --> 00:15:16,390
kept pointing to a box on his desk in

292
00:15:23,080 --> 00:15:20,510
his house and he said that right there

293
00:15:25,480 --> 00:15:23,090
will prove the existence of what I mean

294
00:15:27,790 --> 00:15:25,490
what I have here he kept saying that to

295
00:15:30,790 --> 00:15:27,800
us but he would never open it and show

296
00:15:33,490 --> 00:15:30,800
us eventually one day one night after

297
00:15:35,890 --> 00:15:33,500
dinner I was there with him you haven't

298
00:15:38,320 --> 00:15:35,900
dinner with him and his wife I asked

299
00:15:39,850 --> 00:15:38,330
Paul I said what about these what about

300
00:15:40,540 --> 00:15:39,860
that box you get pointing to what's in

301
00:15:44,140 --> 00:15:40,550
that box

302
00:15:44,680 --> 00:15:44,150
he said photographs I said well can I

303
00:15:48,370 --> 00:15:44,690
see it

304
00:15:50,290 --> 00:15:48,380
so he opened we went from his dining

305
00:15:53,640 --> 00:15:50,300
room table to his office he opened up

306
00:15:56,770 --> 00:15:53,650
the box and he laid out on a big table

307
00:15:59,260 --> 00:15:56,780
somewhat a conference table he said I

308
00:16:00,940 --> 00:15:59,270
want you to go to the other room and I'm

309
00:16:02,590 --> 00:16:00,950
gonna lay these out because because I

310
00:16:05,020 --> 00:16:02,600
want you to see what order I'm putting

311
00:16:06,940 --> 00:16:05,030
them in well I'm gonna eventually see it

312
00:16:08,770 --> 00:16:06,950
but I said I did what he asked me to do

313
00:16:11,050 --> 00:16:08,780
I came back and I looked at and I wasn't

314
00:16:14,020 --> 00:16:11,060
supposed to touch him but he did have he

315
00:16:17,740 --> 00:16:14,030
had I don't know how many quite a few

316
00:16:22,030 --> 00:16:17,750
I'd say maybe 50 somewhere between 45

317
00:16:25,030 --> 00:16:22,040
and 50 photographs of UFOs that were on

318
00:16:28,090 --> 00:16:25,040
the ground that were in the air that

319
00:16:31,780 --> 00:16:28,100
were flying next to aircrafts well some

320
00:16:35,610 --> 00:16:31,790
of them I recognized as as photographs

321
00:16:38,890 --> 00:16:35,620
taken somewhere else or in some other

322
00:16:41,320 --> 00:16:38,900
venue a one particular one I saw that I

323
00:16:43,720 --> 00:16:41,330
recognized immediately was a it was a

324
00:16:45,700 --> 00:16:43,730
photograph of the McMinnville Oregon

325
00:16:47,980 --> 00:16:45,710
incident I'm sure Jimmy you know about

326
00:16:49,810 --> 00:16:47,990
that of course right sometime in the

327
00:16:52,210 --> 00:16:49,820
fifties I don't remember exactly when in

328
00:16:53,650 --> 00:16:52,220
the 50s well I looked at these and I

329
00:16:56,830 --> 00:16:53,660
didn't want to embarrass him and say

330
00:16:59,920 --> 00:16:56,840
well I've seen these before so a lot of

331
00:17:04,449 --> 00:16:59,930
them were pictures that were had already

332
00:17:07,300 --> 00:17:04,459
been in in certain circuits someplace in

333
00:17:08,590 --> 00:17:07,310
magazines or some other of course we

334
00:17:10,720 --> 00:17:08,600
didn't have the internet back then so it

335
00:17:13,240 --> 00:17:10,730
hadn't been magazines or books or

336
00:17:16,439 --> 00:17:13,250
something and it looked to me like most

337
00:17:19,960 --> 00:17:16,449
of them were a picture of a picture and

338
00:17:21,730 --> 00:17:19,970
but there were some that he he dead he

339
00:17:24,840 --> 00:17:21,740
had taken and it was clear that he had

340
00:17:28,270 --> 00:17:24,850
taken him over Kirtland Air Force Base

341
00:17:30,940 --> 00:17:28,280
because of the terrain I could look at

342
00:17:33,550 --> 00:17:30,950
the Train and see it was Kirtland but he

343
00:17:37,360 --> 00:17:33,560
took pictures of things and I can't to

344
00:17:41,170 --> 00:17:37,370
this day explain what he was what he

345
00:17:43,450 --> 00:17:41,180
took a picture of in fact are we had an

346
00:17:46,030 --> 00:17:43,460
expert had some another agent who was a

347
00:17:48,340 --> 00:17:46,040
photographic specialist come in and look

348
00:17:51,130 --> 00:17:48,350
at these pictures to see to try to

349
00:17:53,410 --> 00:17:51,140
figure out what is that and when was

350
00:17:55,830 --> 00:17:53,420
that taken and he had a day yeah daytime

351
00:17:59,410 --> 00:17:55,840
so we knew when it was taken but we

352
00:18:02,620 --> 00:17:59,420
there wasn't any other record on base of

353
00:18:05,830 --> 00:18:02,630
anybody reporting a particularly ruler

354
00:18:08,170 --> 00:18:05,840
for some other craft unusual craft lying

355
00:18:10,560 --> 00:18:08,180
next to it an aircraft coming in for

356
00:18:13,630 --> 00:18:10,570
landing so you had some that were

357
00:18:15,220 --> 00:18:13,640
unexplained but most of those were

358
00:18:17,020 --> 00:18:15,230
easily explained

359
00:18:21,700 --> 00:18:17,030
that has him taking a picture of a

360
00:18:24,280 --> 00:18:21,710
picture did you again I'm referring to

361
00:18:28,060 --> 00:18:24,290
urban legend you're with me now and I

362
00:18:29,620 --> 00:18:28,070
appreciate you being here and and

363
00:18:30,789 --> 00:18:29,630
answering these questions because we

364
00:18:34,630 --> 00:18:30,799
these are things that we've always

365
00:18:38,020 --> 00:18:34,640
wanted to know did you provide Paul Ben

366
00:18:41,890 --> 00:18:38,030
of Ben awaits documents pertaining to

367
00:18:48,310 --> 00:18:41,900
the UFO subject proving the existence of

368
00:18:51,630 --> 00:18:48,320
UFOs that you created no no no what we

369
00:18:58,530 --> 00:18:51,640
what we I didn't even do it another

370
00:19:03,520 --> 00:18:58,540
agent did this and and we we took a

371
00:19:10,780 --> 00:19:03,530
particular briefing document that we had

372
00:19:13,930 --> 00:19:10,790
and we let Paul read it and it was in

373
00:19:15,940 --> 00:19:13,940
fact classified I mean the

374
00:19:19,060 --> 00:19:15,950
classification wasn't real we put a

375
00:19:21,610 --> 00:19:19,070
classification on it to convince Paul

376
00:19:24,280 --> 00:19:21,620
that what he was reading was real but I

377
00:19:26,560 --> 00:19:24,290
didn't do that I wasn't there at the

378
00:19:28,390 --> 00:19:26,570
time fact during that time period I was

379
00:19:32,310 --> 00:19:28,400
in Washington DC this is something else

380
00:19:36,340 --> 00:19:32,320
but some other people had done that now

381
00:19:41,200 --> 00:19:36,350
NSA had a long two-hour meeting with

382
00:19:44,890 --> 00:19:41,210
Paul some time towards the end of the

383
00:19:49,180 --> 00:19:44,900
operation and I'm not sure what they did

384
00:19:51,549 --> 00:19:49,190
or what they showed him I know what has

385
00:19:54,880 --> 00:19:51,559
been written and I know why you asked

386
00:19:57,789 --> 00:19:54,890
that question but I never personally

387
00:20:00,630 --> 00:19:57,799
showed him anything like that why what's

388
00:20:05,080 --> 00:20:00,640
the goal in doing something like that

389
00:20:06,640 --> 00:20:05,090
you know is it okay I'll let you answer

390
00:20:08,830 --> 00:20:06,650
that because you know I've got like

391
00:20:12,730 --> 00:20:08,840
three questions out of my right behind

392
00:20:16,380 --> 00:20:12,740
that but what's the goal in doing that

393
00:20:19,330 --> 00:20:16,390
it's spreading it's spreading something

394
00:20:20,710 --> 00:20:19,340
is spreading disinformation your that

395
00:20:22,299 --> 00:20:20,720
that's what you want to say yeah

396
00:20:27,710 --> 00:20:22,309
absolutely I agree with number percent

397
00:20:29,510 --> 00:20:27,720
but what we what we do hold on Richard

398
00:20:31,970 --> 00:20:29,520
hold on hold on hold on let's back up

399
00:20:34,549 --> 00:20:31,980
for a second you said that you showed

400
00:20:36,830 --> 00:20:34,559
him a briefing document that you changed

401
00:20:38,720 --> 00:20:36,840
the class you added a classification -

402
00:20:41,630 --> 00:20:38,730
are you saying that that briefing

403
00:20:43,310 --> 00:20:41,640
document was not that that was

404
00:20:47,120 --> 00:20:43,320
disinformation or was the briefing

405
00:20:50,779 --> 00:20:47,130
document an actual briefing document I'm

406
00:20:53,630 --> 00:20:50,789
confused document it was a it was

407
00:20:55,850 --> 00:20:53,640
disinformation it wasn't real there were

408
00:20:59,419 --> 00:20:55,860
some of the things in it probably was

409
00:21:02,060 --> 00:20:59,429
like I said I didn't I saw this later I

410
00:21:04,789 --> 00:21:02,070
I saw it in the file later that it was

411
00:21:08,140 --> 00:21:04,799
done by an another agent

412
00:21:11,120 --> 00:21:08,150
so when you say me I didn't my

413
00:21:14,930 --> 00:21:11,130
organization therefore sauce I did right

414
00:21:19,789 --> 00:21:14,940
but I didn't person I didn't create

415
00:21:22,549 --> 00:21:19,799
right what I want to do it was a fake

416
00:21:25,190 --> 00:21:22,559
document with the fake classification

417
00:21:27,200 --> 00:21:25,200
used for disinformation shown to Paul

418
00:21:29,659 --> 00:21:27,210
bennewitz you were in DC you weren't

419
00:21:35,480 --> 00:21:29,669
there when the fake document was shown

420
00:21:37,190 --> 00:21:35,490
to him now right no now now we're clear

421
00:21:39,110 --> 00:21:37,200
okay I just wanted to get that other way

422
00:21:41,120 --> 00:21:39,120
I didn't know if you see it sounded like

423
00:21:42,890 --> 00:21:41,130
you had suggested that the document was

424
00:21:44,899 --> 00:21:42,900
real you just added a top secret

425
00:21:47,659 --> 00:21:44,909
classification but that wasn't the case

426
00:21:52,610 --> 00:21:47,669
it was it was it was a fake document all

427
00:21:54,289 --> 00:21:52,620
along got it okay so it was secret it

428
00:21:54,890 --> 00:21:54,299
was secret I don't believe it was top

429
00:21:58,370 --> 00:21:54,900
secret

430
00:22:00,500 --> 00:21:58,380
I carry my as far as I can remember it

431
00:22:02,750 --> 00:22:00,510
was secret I believe it was just secret

432
00:22:07,430 --> 00:22:02,760
you know was it I think it was a one or

433
00:22:10,700 --> 00:22:07,440
two page like a summary you spent a long

434
00:22:13,370 --> 00:22:10,710
time so I I can't remember but but the

435
00:22:20,029 --> 00:22:13,380
reason we do this the reason we did that

436
00:22:22,640 --> 00:22:20,039
is if somebody was if somebody had

437
00:22:27,529 --> 00:22:22,650
gotten into some real information some

438
00:22:30,710 --> 00:22:27,539
real top-secret communications systems

439
00:22:33,590 --> 00:22:30,720
or real top secret operations that were

440
00:22:38,630 --> 00:22:33,600
occurring on Kirtland that involved some

441
00:22:41,390 --> 00:22:38,640
really highly classified projects we

442
00:22:44,450 --> 00:22:41,400
won't would want that person to think

443
00:22:49,220 --> 00:22:44,460
what they were actually seeing was UFOs

444
00:22:51,020 --> 00:22:49,230
and not real US government operations

445
00:22:53,870 --> 00:22:51,030
where they can go out and start

446
00:22:55,580 --> 00:22:53,880
spreading this out and and eventually

447
00:22:57,530 --> 00:22:55,590
during that time period of course the

448
00:23:01,070 --> 00:22:57,540
Soviets would would would end up with it

449
00:23:03,230 --> 00:23:01,080
so so it's a it's a what we don't call

450
00:23:04,400 --> 00:23:03,240
it this information called

451
00:23:05,870 --> 00:23:04,410
counterintelligence of the

452
00:23:09,020 --> 00:23:05,880
counterintelligence operation where we

453
00:23:14,300 --> 00:23:09,030
try to keep them thinking okay it's it's

454
00:23:16,250 --> 00:23:14,310
a UFO it's not really a a a I mean we

455
00:23:18,620 --> 00:23:16,260
think we want them to think it's a UFO

456
00:23:22,700 --> 00:23:18,630
and not the real operation that they

457
00:23:25,550 --> 00:23:22,710
might have accidentally got into and now

458
00:23:29,690 --> 00:23:25,560
this disinformation obviously is going

459
00:23:32,750 --> 00:23:29,700
to snowball throughout the UFO community

460
00:23:36,260 --> 00:23:32,760
too as well I mean it was that part of

461
00:23:41,150 --> 00:23:36,270
it was that part of your goal no and we

462
00:23:43,520 --> 00:23:41,160
we we didn't at that point we didn't

463
00:23:47,930 --> 00:23:43,530
look beyond Paul bennewitz the operation

464
00:23:50,840 --> 00:23:47,940
was was targeted for Paul bennewitz and

465
00:23:53,600 --> 00:23:50,850
his companies under scientific right eye

466
00:23:57,110 --> 00:23:53,610
and what where it went from there what

467
00:23:59,300 --> 00:23:57,120
wouldn't be our responsibility and let

468
00:24:01,910 --> 00:23:59,310
me tell you now what and this is no

469
00:24:06,380 --> 00:24:01,920
longer classified because it was

470
00:24:09,560 --> 00:24:06,390
Declassified some years ago what the Air

471
00:24:12,980 --> 00:24:09,570
Force was do what NSA was doing was they

472
00:24:16,100 --> 00:24:12,990
had a facility on Kirtland that was

473
00:24:18,560 --> 00:24:16,110
shooting a laser at Soviet satellites as

474
00:24:23,630 --> 00:24:18,570
it was coming over and there was a

475
00:24:26,630 --> 00:24:23,640
communication system used to to mask and

476
00:24:29,930 --> 00:24:26,640
I'm not I'm explaining as a layperson

477
00:24:32,120 --> 00:24:29,940
sure to mannequin and and Paul had

478
00:24:34,340 --> 00:24:32,130
tapped into that communication system

479
00:24:37,730 --> 00:24:34,350
and the frequencies involved in doing

480
00:24:40,940 --> 00:24:37,740
this and and what this what this elazer

481
00:24:43,190 --> 00:24:40,950
would do is is basically blind the

482
00:24:46,010 --> 00:24:43,200
Soviet satellite as it was flying over

483
00:24:49,430 --> 00:24:46,020
and they had it there and they had it

484
00:24:51,410 --> 00:24:49,440
out of area 51 and it had a couple other

485
00:24:54,320 --> 00:24:51,420
facilities and this was an experimental

486
00:24:55,130 --> 00:24:54,330
stage they didn't have an operational

487
00:24:58,490 --> 00:24:55,140
but they

488
00:25:00,800 --> 00:24:58,500
were they were doing that and so that's

489
00:25:03,850 --> 00:25:00,810
why it was highly classified back then

490
00:25:08,030 --> 00:25:03,860
so that's why we couldn't let that out

491
00:25:12,350 --> 00:25:08,040
but why not and as certainly hindsight

492
00:25:15,190 --> 00:25:12,360
is very dangerous Richard but why not

493
00:25:18,200 --> 00:25:15,200
just tell him the truth

494
00:25:20,840 --> 00:25:18,210
why not just tell them as an American

495
00:25:23,120 --> 00:25:20,850
citizen you would understand hey man you

496
00:25:25,910 --> 00:25:23,130
know Soviets we got this thing going on

497
00:25:28,490 --> 00:25:25,920
you've tapped into that it's not UFOs

498
00:25:30,860 --> 00:25:28,500
and this is very highly classified so

499
00:25:32,270 --> 00:25:30,870
just do your duty as a patriot and keep

500
00:25:35,920 --> 00:25:32,280
your mouth shut that's what's really

501
00:25:38,510 --> 00:25:35,930
going on no harm no foul

502
00:25:40,940 --> 00:25:38,520
well like you said

503
00:25:44,720 --> 00:25:40,950
hindsight's always 20/20 most of the

504
00:25:48,530 --> 00:25:44,730
time is 220 but I wasn't in a position

505
00:25:51,880 --> 00:25:48,540
to write the operations of operational

506
00:25:55,250 --> 00:25:51,890
plan this comes from a supervisor

507
00:25:57,860 --> 00:25:55,260
headquarters in Washington intelligence

508
00:26:00,650 --> 00:25:57,870
community and they they decide and what

509
00:26:02,270 --> 00:26:00,660
how they are going to conduct these

510
00:26:05,690 --> 00:26:02,280
operations and how they're going to

511
00:26:07,460 --> 00:26:05,700
target people and I'm the player and the

512
00:26:10,190 --> 00:26:07,470
bottom of the totem pole that is

513
00:26:13,820 --> 00:26:10,200
actually doing this I'm that agent in

514
00:26:17,180 --> 00:26:13,830
the field doing this so yeah it would it

515
00:26:19,940 --> 00:26:17,190
would probably as some in some instances

516
00:26:23,060 --> 00:26:19,950
that would be better to just tell them

517
00:26:24,920 --> 00:26:23,070
the truth but I didn't have the option

518
00:26:28,970 --> 00:26:24,930
of doing that might have saved a man's

519
00:26:31,190 --> 00:26:28,980
life you know again hindsight but let me

520
00:26:36,170 --> 00:26:31,200
okay now it's let's keep going I've got

521
00:26:39,950 --> 00:26:36,180
a hundred questions for you Richard Paul

522
00:26:41,930 --> 00:26:39,960
bennewitz Paul bennewitz he smoked three

523
00:26:45,760 --> 00:26:41,940
to four pack of cigarettes a day right

524
00:26:51,530 --> 00:26:48,410
continuously every time he looked at him

525
00:26:54,580 --> 00:26:51,540
he had at coca-cola he would he would

526
00:26:58,430 --> 00:26:54,590
have nodded not a can but a quart size

527
00:27:01,220 --> 00:26:58,440
so he wasn't in very good health in the

528
00:27:06,170 --> 00:27:01,230
early 80s and even when he when they

529
00:27:08,420 --> 00:27:06,180
made him stop smoking later on he you

530
00:27:09,049 --> 00:27:08,430
know his health had deteriorated because

531
00:27:14,629 --> 00:27:09,059
of

532
00:27:17,359 --> 00:27:14,639
smoking I mean I was in the room isn't

533
00:27:21,559 --> 00:27:17,369
in his hospital room when a doctor came

534
00:27:24,819 --> 00:27:21,569
in and said to him Paul you killed

535
00:27:28,969 --> 00:27:24,829
yourself over these 55 years of smoking

536
00:27:31,429 --> 00:27:28,979
there's nothing we can do about that but

537
00:27:34,399 --> 00:27:31,439
we're trying to do everything we can to

538
00:27:36,949 --> 00:27:34,409
keep your you know keep your life active

539
00:27:39,439 --> 00:27:36,959
but but but that's you know Paul wasn't

540
00:27:41,779 --> 00:27:39,449
in the best of physical condition so

541
00:27:44,359 --> 00:27:41,789
when we say might have kept him alive

542
00:27:45,709 --> 00:27:44,369
I would doubt that yeah I know he went

543
00:27:48,319 --> 00:27:45,719
in the hospital he had a nervous

544
00:27:50,269 --> 00:27:48,329
breakdown but but that would call was

545
00:27:52,549 --> 00:27:50,279
caused by a couple other factors one of

546
00:27:55,489 --> 00:27:52,559
them is a business thunder scientific

547
00:27:59,899 --> 00:27:55,499
laboratories I had lost a real big

548
00:28:04,909 --> 00:27:59,909
contract because of him Paul Paul was so

549
00:28:07,789 --> 00:28:04,919
hung up with this this UFO business that

550
00:28:10,009 --> 00:28:07,799
he neglected what he should have been

551
00:28:12,999 --> 00:28:10,019
doing in his business well of course

552
00:28:17,719 --> 00:28:13,009
Richard of course because he was shown

553
00:28:21,229 --> 00:28:17,729
documents that they were real from his

554
00:28:25,009 --> 00:28:21,239
own government and so absolutely I think

555
00:28:27,829 --> 00:28:25,019
if I cannot imagine how many people will

556
00:28:30,079 --> 00:28:27,839
be pushed over the edge you know given

557
00:28:33,529 --> 00:28:30,089
that same circumstance you know myself

558
00:28:36,559 --> 00:28:33,539
included you know that's a pretty crazy

559
00:28:38,389 --> 00:28:36,569
thing to show to somebody we always you

560
00:28:40,999 --> 00:28:38,399
know we have that question you know are

561
00:28:43,489 --> 00:28:41,009
we being visited what am I seeing in the

562
00:28:46,279 --> 00:28:43,499
sky is it is it really is it this it and

563
00:28:49,009 --> 00:28:46,289
then you know your own government says

564
00:28:50,989 --> 00:28:49,019
hey man okay you know they're real and

565
00:28:53,869 --> 00:28:50,999
we want you to come in and and work with

566
00:28:57,109 --> 00:28:53,879
us that that to somebody that may not be

567
00:29:00,079 --> 00:28:57,119
already stable is is a is a bad position

568
00:29:02,899 --> 00:29:00,089
to put somebody in I wasn't there but

569
00:29:05,989 --> 00:29:02,909
I'm just saying if I was shown documents

570
00:29:08,839 --> 00:29:05,999
and and from the government not from you

571
00:29:10,789 --> 00:29:08,849
know some ufologists right but from the

572
00:29:14,329 --> 00:29:10,799
Air Force themselves

573
00:29:17,029 --> 00:29:14,339
holy crap right well okay let me let's

574
00:29:19,909 --> 00:29:17,039
and that's my take I don't know about

575
00:29:22,110 --> 00:29:19,919
the cigarettes and and and the physical

576
00:29:23,789 --> 00:29:22,120
health and and the coca-cola but

577
00:29:29,310 --> 00:29:23,799
you're making me want to change my diet

578
00:29:33,779 --> 00:29:29,320
for sure is this Richard what about the

579
00:29:37,860 --> 00:29:33,789
the Dulce situation there again I'm

580
00:29:40,799 --> 00:29:37,870
going back to urban legend but did you

581
00:29:42,269 --> 00:29:40,809
push him in that direction as well the

582
00:29:47,990 --> 00:29:42,279
underground base yeah

583
00:29:50,610 --> 00:29:48,000
no no Paul had already prepared us

584
00:29:53,060 --> 00:29:50,620
becoming involved in this operation Paul

585
00:29:57,899 --> 00:29:53,070
had already made a number of trips to

586
00:30:00,210 --> 00:29:57,909
Dulce and he had gotten information from

587
00:30:01,889 --> 00:30:00,220
this other person and I don't really

588
00:30:03,269 --> 00:30:01,899
want to bring this other person involved

589
00:30:07,260 --> 00:30:03,279
in it but there's actually it was an

590
00:30:11,430 --> 00:30:07,270
operation never been disclosed but there

591
00:30:14,970 --> 00:30:11,440
was a an operation involving another

592
00:30:20,700 --> 00:30:14,980
person that was Paul's friend in this

593
00:30:23,130 --> 00:30:20,710
this whole business and he got Paul

594
00:30:27,720 --> 00:30:23,140
involved in a dulce incident Archuleta P

595
00:30:30,750 --> 00:30:27,730
mm-hmm excuse me Paul Paul told me one

596
00:30:34,049 --> 00:30:30,760
day when I was having a discussion with

597
00:30:36,570 --> 00:30:34,059
him he said well I know where the alien

598
00:30:40,590 --> 00:30:36,580
bases located it's happened Dulce New

599
00:30:42,090 --> 00:30:40,600
Mexico it's it Archuleta peak and I said

600
00:30:43,260 --> 00:30:42,100
well how do you know that he said

601
00:30:45,090 --> 00:30:43,270
because I've been up there and I've

602
00:30:47,310 --> 00:30:45,100
taken pictures and you know then he

603
00:30:49,590 --> 00:30:47,320
showed me every way showed me a video he

604
00:30:52,019 --> 00:30:49,600
flew over oh right maybe he took a plane

605
00:30:54,690 --> 00:30:52,029
up there yeah he did the plane up there

606
00:30:57,750 --> 00:30:54,700
right but and and he had taken some

607
00:31:00,149 --> 00:30:57,760
pictures of some things and and he

608
00:31:02,190 --> 00:31:00,159
actually him in this this other his

609
00:31:03,930 --> 00:31:02,200
colleague had camped up there overnight

610
00:31:06,299 --> 00:31:03,940
or camped near there overnight

611
00:31:08,760 --> 00:31:06,309
I believe they slept in a vehicle or

612
00:31:10,169 --> 00:31:08,770
something anyways they spent the night

613
00:31:12,539 --> 00:31:10,179
and they took some videos that were

614
00:31:14,639 --> 00:31:12,549
really out really I mean I looked at

615
00:31:17,880 --> 00:31:14,649
these videos I couldn't explain them in

616
00:31:19,500 --> 00:31:17,890
wow this is really neat so anyways I

617
00:31:22,260 --> 00:31:19,510
said the flies what picked me up there

618
00:31:24,659 --> 00:31:22,270
sometimes so we did we went up there we

619
00:31:27,630 --> 00:31:24,669
sat around we looked around we didn't we

620
00:31:30,200 --> 00:31:27,640
drove around didn't really see much but

621
00:31:34,380 --> 00:31:30,210
he pointed out where everything was that

622
00:31:35,549 --> 00:31:34,390
well a week or so later we went up there

623
00:31:37,169 --> 00:31:35,559
and we we went up there

624
00:31:40,619 --> 00:31:37,179
so we were would be up there at night

625
00:31:42,810 --> 00:31:40,629
and then we saw helicopters we saw

626
00:31:45,299 --> 00:31:42,820
helicopters we saw these strange lights

627
00:31:48,090 --> 00:31:45,309
up there and I started wondering what

628
00:31:50,549 --> 00:31:48,100
the heck was this stuff so when when we

629
00:31:52,950 --> 00:31:50,559
got back I said to Paul I said we you

630
00:31:55,519 --> 00:31:52,960
know I don't know what that is Paul III

631
00:31:58,230 --> 00:31:55,529
said but those helicopters were were

632
00:31:59,879 --> 00:31:58,240
vietnam-era helicopters I mean I know

633
00:32:03,060 --> 00:31:59,889
that they were Huey's er

634
00:32:06,419 --> 00:32:03,070
I said but and there were some I don't I

635
00:32:07,980 --> 00:32:06,429
couldn't recognise so I said but I don't

636
00:32:09,869 --> 00:32:07,990
know about those those strange lights

637
00:32:13,710 --> 00:32:09,879
and those strange beings I don't know

638
00:32:16,080 --> 00:32:13,720
what they were well I went up to Fort

639
00:32:19,440 --> 00:32:16,090
Carson Colorado a few weeks later and

640
00:32:23,310 --> 00:32:19,450
met with a special forces unit up there

641
00:32:28,200 --> 00:32:23,320
and found out that they used that area

642
00:32:30,389 --> 00:32:28,210
for military operations and I asked one

643
00:32:34,680 --> 00:32:30,399
of the pilots actually the commander he

644
00:32:37,499 --> 00:32:34,690
was also the senior pilots about these

645
00:32:41,820 --> 00:32:37,509
strange lights or strange beams he said

646
00:32:44,700 --> 00:32:41,830
well he said we have lights underground

647
00:32:46,409 --> 00:32:44,710
I mean we have these lights there in the

648
00:32:50,159 --> 00:32:46,419
building the ground that was shined up

649
00:32:52,739 --> 00:32:50,169
and they simulated different things for

650
00:32:54,629 --> 00:32:52,749
the helicopter pilots he said so we

651
00:32:56,730 --> 00:32:54,639
turned them on when Paul captured pilots

652
00:32:58,560 --> 00:32:56,740
are coming in he said so I can just

653
00:33:00,090 --> 00:32:58,570
imagine how strange they would look if

654
00:33:02,580 --> 00:33:00,100
somebody was down on the model of the

655
00:33:04,859 --> 00:33:02,590
mountain looking up so that explained to

656
00:33:08,190 --> 00:33:04,869
me what they were but I never told

657
00:33:10,409 --> 00:33:08,200
Paulie and and and Paul would would

658
00:33:12,600 --> 00:33:10,419
always tell people that there was an

659
00:33:16,950 --> 00:33:12,610
underground base in archuleta I never

660
00:33:18,930 --> 00:33:16,960
told him there was and I didn't I didn't

661
00:33:21,359 --> 00:33:18,940
ever support that because it really

662
00:33:24,090 --> 00:33:21,369
wasn't in the operational plan I mean

663
00:33:25,649 --> 00:33:24,100
that that was just something that he he

664
00:33:26,909 --> 00:33:25,659
wanted to believe in and would let me

665
00:33:30,570 --> 00:33:26,919
know if he wants to believe in it he

666
00:33:33,299 --> 00:33:30,580
believed in it but and well Richard I

667
00:33:34,710 --> 00:33:33,309
never told him there was a B right but

668
00:33:36,119 --> 00:33:34,720
you didn't tell him that there wasn't a

669
00:33:37,590 --> 00:33:36,129
base no I

670
00:33:39,749 --> 00:33:37,600
that's right I didn't tell him there

671
00:33:42,600 --> 00:33:39,759
wasn't a base did he seem at that time

672
00:33:45,149 --> 00:33:42,610
did he seem stable

673
00:33:49,740 --> 00:33:45,159
wouldn't it have maybe again hindsight

674
00:33:51,630 --> 00:33:49,750
right but to - maybe not mess with them

675
00:33:52,799 --> 00:33:51,640
at all and maybe come clean on that and

676
00:33:55,139 --> 00:33:52,809
tell them that you know these are

677
00:33:56,940 --> 00:33:55,149
special operations forces up there and I

678
00:33:58,889 --> 00:33:56,950
thought it was something strange so I

679
00:34:00,539 --> 00:33:58,899
went chat it out for myself I spoke to

680
00:34:04,380 --> 00:34:00,549
them and this is actually what's going

681
00:34:08,639 --> 00:34:04,390
on well he knew I went to Fort Carson

682
00:34:09,810 --> 00:34:08,649
because I told him that and but he he

683
00:34:13,490 --> 00:34:09,820
was under the impression that the

684
00:34:16,710 --> 00:34:13,500
government and I don't have enough time

685
00:34:20,339 --> 00:34:16,720
here I would take hours and hours to

686
00:34:23,099 --> 00:34:20,349
explain to you sure a paw told me and

687
00:34:26,460 --> 00:34:23,109
what he thought he knew and so it was

688
00:34:28,470 --> 00:34:26,470
very difficult for me to convince

689
00:34:32,750 --> 00:34:28,480
convince him otherwise so I never did

690
00:34:35,460 --> 00:34:32,760
Paul would would spend 30 minutes

691
00:34:39,149 --> 00:34:35,470
talking to me without me ever saying a

692
00:34:42,389 --> 00:34:39,159
word he was conveying to convince me

693
00:34:45,690 --> 00:34:42,399
that what he was saying was in fact

694
00:34:49,680 --> 00:34:45,700
extraterrestrial and he would go on and

695
00:34:52,500 --> 00:34:49,690
on and on and on and and I would contain

696
00:34:54,389 --> 00:34:52,510
any wise and I finally would say to him

697
00:34:58,290 --> 00:34:54,399
you know I'd make the time out sign I

698
00:35:01,650 --> 00:34:58,300
said pop I'm out I'm gonna have to step

699
00:35:04,800 --> 00:35:01,660
in here say a few words and at times I

700
00:35:07,140 --> 00:35:04,810
would try to convince him to stream back

701
00:35:08,700 --> 00:35:07,150
onto what we wanted him and and he

702
00:35:12,510 --> 00:35:08,710
wouldn't he would get off the subject

703
00:35:14,640 --> 00:35:12,520
and then years later I mean I was I was

704
00:35:17,760 --> 00:35:14,650
friends with Paul right up until he

705
00:35:19,890 --> 00:35:17,770
passed away he was my friend he would

706
00:35:22,890 --> 00:35:19,900
call me he would invite me over to his

707
00:35:24,780 --> 00:35:22,900
house my wife and it went over there we

708
00:35:29,220 --> 00:35:24,790
had dinner a number of times we were out

709
00:35:31,920 --> 00:35:29,230
to dinner and and at those times I tried

710
00:35:34,950 --> 00:35:31,930
I tried my darkness to convince Paul

711
00:35:36,839 --> 00:35:34,960
that it was but he was saying was my

712
00:35:39,690 --> 00:35:36,849
extraterrestrial I never told him it was

713
00:35:42,089 --> 00:35:39,700
you know what the the the classified

714
00:35:44,540 --> 00:35:42,099
project was but I told him Paul you

715
00:35:47,099 --> 00:35:44,550
didn't see you didn't see a

716
00:35:49,079 --> 00:35:47,109
extraterrestrials what you're seeing on

717
00:35:51,839 --> 00:35:49,089
that computer screen isn't actually a

718
00:35:54,990 --> 00:35:51,849
trust or talking to you but he couldn't

719
00:35:56,200 --> 00:35:55,000
be he wouldn't listen to me and he had a

720
00:35:58,120 --> 00:35:56,210
computer screen

721
00:36:00,310 --> 00:35:58,130
you know well I think it was a Commodore

722
00:36:02,680 --> 00:36:00,320
I think they would call Commodore is

723
00:36:04,900 --> 00:36:02,690
back then anyways he had a screen he had

724
00:36:07,839 --> 00:36:04,910
it rigged up and he had all these

725
00:36:10,000 --> 00:36:07,849
antennas on his roof and he had it he

726
00:36:13,839 --> 00:36:10,010
had actually a small microwave actually

727
00:36:15,849 --> 00:36:13,849
he we actually had FCC came and made him

728
00:36:18,849 --> 00:36:15,859
get a license for it but anyways he had

729
00:36:21,849 --> 00:36:18,859
a small portable microwave on his roof

730
00:36:24,430 --> 00:36:21,859
and he would look at the screen and it

731
00:36:27,280 --> 00:36:24,440
would be images on the screen but it

732
00:36:29,560 --> 00:36:27,290
certainly wasn't of an alien but he was

733
00:36:32,290 --> 00:36:29,570
convinced that was and I would actually

734
00:36:34,750 --> 00:36:32,300
tell him I don't see anything he said I

735
00:36:37,030 --> 00:36:34,760
see it and I can hear him and he had

736
00:36:38,740 --> 00:36:37,040
these earphones that he would put on and

737
00:36:41,050 --> 00:36:38,750
he said I can hear I'm talking they said

738
00:36:42,460 --> 00:36:41,060
what language are they speaking he said

739
00:36:43,870 --> 00:36:42,470
they're speaking their language

740
00:36:45,849 --> 00:36:43,880
I said well you don't understand their

741
00:36:48,579 --> 00:36:45,859
language do you BA he said no but I know

742
00:36:53,859 --> 00:36:48,589
that it's an intelligent language and he

743
00:36:58,240 --> 00:36:53,869
wrote a whole gosh probably a hundred

744
00:37:01,690 --> 00:36:58,250
page document they were tight they was

745
00:37:04,480 --> 00:37:01,700
typed about the alien language he wrote

746
00:37:06,460 --> 00:37:04,490
and he gave it to us when he came out

747
00:37:10,060 --> 00:37:06,470
the Kirtland to present give his

748
00:37:12,280 --> 00:37:10,070
presentation to all these generals he

749
00:37:15,099 --> 00:37:12,290
presented them with that and plus all

750
00:37:18,250 --> 00:37:15,109
these other documents that he created to

751
00:37:20,560 --> 00:37:18,260
convince try to convince them that the

752
00:37:23,710 --> 00:37:20,570
Kirtland Air Force Base was in danger of

753
00:37:26,320 --> 00:37:23,720
an alien invasion what does the Air

754
00:37:27,730 --> 00:37:26,330
Force know what is it that they are not

755
00:37:32,339 --> 00:37:27,740
telling it's not about Paul bennewitz

756
00:37:36,310 --> 00:37:32,349
about the UFO question what do they know

757
00:37:42,250 --> 00:37:36,320
well I know what I was briefed on and in

758
00:37:45,579 --> 00:37:42,260
1979 and I'm convinced I have no reason

759
00:37:48,579 --> 00:37:45,589
to think otherwise or to believe

760
00:37:51,790 --> 00:37:48,589
otherwise that we had been visited we

761
00:37:53,380 --> 00:37:51,800
have been visited Roswell was real there

762
00:37:56,800 --> 00:37:53,390
were other crash sites that were real

763
00:37:58,210 --> 00:37:56,810
and the Air Force knows the government

764
00:38:00,040 --> 00:37:58,220
knows not just the Air Force to the

765
00:38:03,870 --> 00:38:00,050
whole government knows and they have

766
00:38:08,320 --> 00:38:03,880
known and and so what I was briefed on

767
00:38:10,089 --> 00:38:08,330
was what occurred in the late forties

768
00:38:14,259 --> 00:38:10,099
and fifties now

769
00:38:16,839 --> 00:38:14,269
has happened since I got I left the the

770
00:38:18,999 --> 00:38:16,849
intelligence community in 1988 so I I

771
00:38:21,880 --> 00:38:19,009
don't know what I know a lot of people

772
00:38:23,890 --> 00:38:21,890
claimed I I'm still involved and they

773
00:38:25,450 --> 00:38:23,900
know that somebody got my records and

774
00:38:28,719 --> 00:38:25,460
found that I was recalled to active duty

775
00:38:30,309 --> 00:38:28,729
back in 1983-84 I was but it wasn't it

776
00:38:37,359 --> 00:38:30,319
am mainly with UFOs

777
00:38:41,079 --> 00:38:37,369
so I can't say it what it was didn't

778
00:38:43,450 --> 00:38:41,089
surprise me of the the the release by

779
00:38:46,210 --> 00:38:43,460
the Air Force and admission that they

780
00:38:49,719 --> 00:38:46,220
had been that of this project that they

781
00:38:53,039 --> 00:38:49,729
had for a number of years that was

782
00:38:54,999 --> 00:38:53,049
started I mean that's the that's the

783
00:38:57,219 --> 00:38:55,009
unclassified portion of it I'm

784
00:39:01,329 --> 00:38:57,229
unconvinced and I have still friends

785
00:39:04,150 --> 00:39:01,339
that are in Gaul I'm convinced that the

786
00:39:07,769 --> 00:39:04,160
Air Force still is investigating these

787
00:39:11,049 --> 00:39:07,779
things and they're still involved in

788
00:39:12,549 --> 00:39:11,059
this project how did the briefing when

789
00:39:15,489 --> 00:39:12,559
you say that you were briefed on Roswell

790
00:39:17,109 --> 00:39:15,499
in other crashes how does that happen

791
00:39:22,109 --> 00:39:17,119
where he's shown documents and

792
00:39:25,479 --> 00:39:22,119
photographs or was it verbatim no

793
00:39:29,620 --> 00:39:25,489
there's a I think there were 20 some of

794
00:39:33,069 --> 00:39:29,630
us in the room it's a special is called

795
00:39:37,900 --> 00:39:33,079
a Air Force special security office that

796
00:39:40,209 --> 00:39:37,910
you briefed in it's code word you have

797
00:39:43,079 --> 00:39:40,219
special clearances to do to get into

798
00:39:47,079 --> 00:39:43,089
this program it's a it's a briefing

799
00:39:49,029 --> 00:39:47,089
video or a film it's back in those days

800
00:39:51,130 --> 00:39:49,039
it was like a I don't know whatever 16

801
00:39:54,239 --> 00:39:51,140
millimeter or whatever they were that he

802
00:39:56,709 --> 00:39:54,249
used it was a film a film briefing

803
00:40:02,589 --> 00:39:56,719
intelligence people on this subject and

804
00:40:04,809 --> 00:40:02,599
it showed old films of the recovery of

805
00:40:08,079 --> 00:40:04,819
their Roswell craft the two crashes a

806
00:40:13,259 --> 00:40:08,089
wanted Corona New Mexico and the one

807
00:40:17,650 --> 00:40:13,269
that meant Galena that horse Mesa and

808
00:40:19,180 --> 00:40:17,660
what the air for what it is in it was in

809
00:40:21,759 --> 00:40:19,190
the prison document there's two there

810
00:40:23,940 --> 00:40:21,769
was two aliens crash the crafts that

811
00:40:25,500 --> 00:40:23,950
crashed that blinded

812
00:40:29,100 --> 00:40:25,510
and then crashed at two different

813
00:40:31,860 --> 00:40:29,110
locations one in cronin mm-hmm not lhasa

814
00:40:34,170 --> 00:40:31,870
well it was north of Roswell but near

815
00:40:40,220 --> 00:40:34,180
Corona south-southeast of Corona and

816
00:40:43,260 --> 00:40:40,230
then one the other craft crashed north

817
00:40:45,630 --> 00:40:43,270
south west the Magdalena in New Mexico

818
00:40:49,020 --> 00:40:45,640
that craft what that crash site wasn't

819
00:40:52,770 --> 00:40:49,030
found until 1949 the crash site near

820
00:40:55,650 --> 00:40:52,780
Corona was found in in 47 Brunt in the

821
00:40:57,690 --> 00:40:55,660
summer for describing the and it was one

822
00:41:01,080 --> 00:40:57,700
live alien that was found in the craft

823
00:41:03,920 --> 00:41:01,090
the crash site in Corona the one in 49

824
00:41:10,200 --> 00:41:03,930
he found bodies but they were they were

825
00:41:14,330 --> 00:41:10,210
decayed horribly so but but the crafts

826
00:41:17,070 --> 00:41:14,340
were similar in nature and so and and

827
00:41:18,930 --> 00:41:17,080
over during the investigation process

828
00:41:21,930 --> 00:41:18,940
back in those days they disfigured that

829
00:41:24,150 --> 00:41:21,940
these two graphs collided and I think it

830
00:41:26,820 --> 00:41:24,160
was an electrical storm and I know Los

831
00:41:29,250 --> 00:41:26,830
Alamos was involved in this and I think

832
00:41:31,380 --> 00:41:29,260
one of the scientists figured it

833
00:41:33,960 --> 00:41:31,390
probably was some kind of electrical

834
00:41:37,410 --> 00:41:33,970
storm that that caused it anyways and

835
00:41:40,080 --> 00:41:37,420
and then the briefing and then there's a

836
00:41:41,670 --> 00:41:40,090
colonel that gave this briefing anyone

837
00:41:44,670 --> 00:41:41,680
on to reiterate a lot of different

838
00:41:46,850 --> 00:41:44,680
things and how the the government was

839
00:41:49,800 --> 00:41:46,860
still investigating these things and and

840
00:41:52,020 --> 00:41:49,810
that there was possibly the possibility

841
00:41:56,010 --> 00:41:52,030
that they were actually trust rules

842
00:41:57,840 --> 00:41:56,020
reasoning or that that we the government

843
00:42:00,720 --> 00:41:57,850
didn't know about but they wanted to

844
00:42:03,960 --> 00:42:00,730
keep track up and when Reagan became

845
00:42:05,760 --> 00:42:03,970
president reagan was briefed on an

846
00:42:09,200 --> 00:42:05,770
incident and I don't know the full

847
00:42:15,150 --> 00:42:09,210
details of it that had occurred in

848
00:42:17,730 --> 00:42:15,160
around Washington DC and the craft was

849
00:42:19,680 --> 00:42:17,740
landed and and and I don't think this

850
00:42:22,710 --> 00:42:19,690
was ever has ever been disclosed by

851
00:42:26,400 --> 00:42:22,720
anybody but and it was I think it was an

852
00:42:28,620 --> 00:42:26,410
82 and a lot of part of 81 anyways that

853
00:42:30,570 --> 00:42:28,630
scared the government that scared the

854
00:42:34,530 --> 00:42:30,580
Air Force let's give it a CIA is scared

855
00:42:37,780 --> 00:42:34,540
FBI and it scared Reagan and Reagan then

856
00:42:40,840 --> 00:42:37,790
started another program to

857
00:42:44,140 --> 00:42:40,850
try to keep track and and and try to

858
00:42:48,100 --> 00:42:44,150
develop some kind of a system to keep

859
00:42:52,960 --> 00:42:48,110
track of everything that entered Earth's

860
00:42:54,940 --> 00:42:52,970
orbit and that was part of the Strategic

861
00:42:58,360 --> 00:42:54,950
Defense Initiative right

862
00:43:02,200 --> 00:42:58,370
did you that's fascinating stuff and I

863
00:43:04,480 --> 00:43:02,210
had never heard heard that before and

864
00:43:10,330 --> 00:43:04,490
neither has the audience I'm sure that

865
00:43:20,920 --> 00:43:10,340
this those comments will be circulating

866
00:43:26,020 --> 00:43:20,930
tomorrow around the Internet okay a

867
00:43:29,230 --> 00:43:26,030
couple of other things when the this

868
00:43:32,110 --> 00:43:29,240
this thing that happened a couple of

869
00:43:35,610 --> 00:43:32,120
months ago now it's December 16th with

870
00:43:41,020 --> 00:43:35,620
that disclosure that went into the media

871
00:43:42,850 --> 00:43:41,030
is is that part of it is that something

872
00:43:45,940 --> 00:43:42,860
that the Air Force would be involved in

873
00:43:48,040 --> 00:43:45,950
in in that type of disclosure with the

874
00:43:50,700 --> 00:43:48,050
with the gun camera footage from the

875
00:43:53,800 --> 00:43:50,710
Navy you know this is the Pentagon

876
00:43:55,810 --> 00:43:53,810
program that apparently was running that

877
00:43:57,430 --> 00:43:55,820
nobody knew about Senator Harry we're

878
00:44:01,540 --> 00:43:57,440
you know you know everything about the

879
00:44:07,690 --> 00:44:01,550
or airy read I'm sorry is that is that

880
00:44:13,120 --> 00:44:07,700
part of disinfo you know I don't think

881
00:44:16,180 --> 00:44:13,130
so I think that's probably somebody as

882
00:44:18,220 --> 00:44:16,190
an office up there that is trying to get

883
00:44:20,530 --> 00:44:18,230
out and getting the truth out a

884
00:44:23,980 --> 00:44:20,540
disclosure out and I'm all for

885
00:44:26,080 --> 00:44:23,990
disclosures I've tried and in a number

886
00:44:27,790 --> 00:44:26,090
of times and and you know people say

887
00:44:29,080 --> 00:44:27,800
well you disinformation I can't we can't

888
00:44:30,550 --> 00:44:29,090
believe anything you say well you know

889
00:44:33,490 --> 00:44:30,560
what you can't believe what I say

890
00:44:35,950 --> 00:44:33,500
because I did my job back in those days

891
00:44:40,090 --> 00:44:35,960
but I don't I'm not I'm not with the

892
00:44:43,300 --> 00:44:40,100
government anymore are they are they are

893
00:44:45,460 --> 00:44:43,310
they are you being paid by them to be on

894
00:44:51,040 --> 00:44:45,470
to call into the show and surprise me

895
00:44:56,560 --> 00:44:53,720
absolutely not well you know they're not

896
00:44:58,790 --> 00:44:56,570
being paid by the government in any way

897
00:45:01,430 --> 00:44:58,800
you know they're saying this right now

898
00:45:04,310 --> 00:45:01,440
out there they're going you know I know

899
00:45:07,280 --> 00:45:04,320
I know he can't convince people you know

900
00:45:09,530 --> 00:45:07,290
the class once told me at a UFO

901
00:45:11,330 --> 00:45:09,540
convention some years ago and I had a

902
00:45:14,840 --> 00:45:11,340
pretty good relationship with even

903
00:45:17,120 --> 00:45:14,850
though III calling the names and and and

904
00:45:19,790 --> 00:45:17,130
threatened to beat his butt if he was

905
00:45:22,100 --> 00:45:19,800
was a little younger but I mean and joke

906
00:45:24,140 --> 00:45:22,110
in a joking manner but Phil told me he

907
00:45:26,480 --> 00:45:24,150
said you know what I don't have to do

908
00:45:28,580 --> 00:45:26,490
anything I have just sit here the UFO

909
00:45:31,030 --> 00:45:28,590
community does more harm to themselves

910
00:45:34,640 --> 00:45:31,040
and I could ever do and that's the truth

911
00:45:40,190 --> 00:45:34,650
what well and which which takes me to

912
00:45:43,850 --> 00:45:40,200
this so let's back up a has there been

913
00:45:46,490 --> 00:45:43,860
an active disinfo campaign going on

914
00:45:48,740 --> 00:45:46,500
inside of the UFO community with other

915
00:45:53,620 --> 00:45:48,750
researchers and conferences and

916
00:45:57,500 --> 00:45:53,630
conventions around the country not not

917
00:46:00,500 --> 00:45:57,510
disinformation but what we did do and I

918
00:46:03,050 --> 00:46:00,510
was involved in this was that we planted

919
00:46:06,950 --> 00:46:03,060
or we co-opted people that were already

920
00:46:08,050 --> 00:46:06,960
involved in the UFO community such as

921
00:46:11,480 --> 00:46:08,060
Bill Moore

922
00:46:14,810 --> 00:46:11,490
that's Rob was all we could yeah we

923
00:46:17,150 --> 00:46:14,820
co-opted them to report on activities

924
00:46:20,510 --> 00:46:17,160
that are occurring within you will hug

925
00:46:22,280 --> 00:46:20,520
you groups April which was you know way

926
00:46:25,010 --> 00:46:22,290
back yeah you know you know that and

927
00:46:28,580 --> 00:46:25,020
MUFON and some of these other other

928
00:46:32,150 --> 00:46:28,590
groups we would just sometimes pay

929
00:46:35,240 --> 00:46:32,160
people to report to us what the what the

930
00:46:39,040 --> 00:46:35,250
UFO group was collecting we never ever

931
00:46:42,290 --> 00:46:39,050
in fact we were absolutely prohibited

932
00:46:45,260 --> 00:46:42,300
from providing information to these

933
00:46:49,400 --> 00:46:45,270
groups all we wanted to do was for them

934
00:46:51,410 --> 00:46:49,410
to report back to us and and we did did

935
00:46:53,740 --> 00:46:51,420
Bill Moore know from the get-go that

936
00:47:00,410 --> 00:46:53,750
that's what was going on

937
00:47:02,990 --> 00:47:00,420
no bill bill Moore was recruited he was

938
00:47:04,730 --> 00:47:03,000
involved in something entirely unrelated

939
00:47:09,140 --> 00:47:04,740
to UFOs

940
00:47:12,290 --> 00:47:09,150
bill Moore had a contact first of all

941
00:47:17,109 --> 00:47:12,300
bill Moore spoke Russian and he learned

942
00:47:22,040 --> 00:47:17,119
it in school and he had a contacts with

943
00:47:25,640 --> 00:47:22,050
Soviet researchers legitimate UFO Soviet

944
00:47:27,260 --> 00:47:25,650
researchers he had a pen pal he call it

945
00:47:30,590 --> 00:47:27,270
a pen pal but he had a contact with

946
00:47:33,770 --> 00:47:30,600
somebody inside Moscow and inside some

947
00:47:36,800 --> 00:47:33,780
Union side mosque in Moscow who who they

948
00:47:39,680 --> 00:47:36,810
corresponded with back and forth well we

949
00:47:42,980 --> 00:47:39,690
we knew about that and when we

950
00:47:47,890 --> 00:47:42,990
approached bill we wanted him to report

951
00:47:53,060 --> 00:47:47,900
to us what this scientist was saying and

952
00:47:54,740 --> 00:47:53,070
expanding that to to allow us to make

953
00:47:57,530 --> 00:47:54,750
contact with this person

954
00:48:00,890 --> 00:47:57,540
the CIA made contact that that person

955
00:48:03,859 --> 00:48:00,900
inside the Soviet Union which which

956
00:48:06,859 --> 00:48:03,869
began an operation and and we that was

957
00:48:11,390 --> 00:48:06,869
very successful and during this time

958
00:48:16,570 --> 00:48:11,400
period you know of course bill had a

959
00:48:19,700 --> 00:48:16,580
number of contacts and within a pro and

960
00:48:23,180 --> 00:48:19,710
MUFON and some other agent some of the

961
00:48:25,910 --> 00:48:23,190
UFO community right because of the the

962
00:48:30,290 --> 00:48:25,920
book he wrote on the Philadelphia

963
00:48:34,010 --> 00:48:30,300
Experiment and then Roswell with who's

964
00:48:36,349 --> 00:48:34,020
to get a Berlitz yeah yeah and so so we

965
00:48:38,930 --> 00:48:36,359
were interested and we that was this

966
00:48:40,820 --> 00:48:38,940
kind of a second thought by our

967
00:48:44,000 --> 00:48:40,830
supervisors and one we get him involved

968
00:48:46,400 --> 00:48:44,010
and get to have him reporting but you

969
00:48:48,980 --> 00:48:46,410
know on what they're doing with in empro

970
00:48:54,230 --> 00:48:48,990
and so he did because bill had a lot of

971
00:48:56,900 --> 00:48:54,240
access to April and another person that

972
00:49:00,830 --> 00:48:56,910
was very very very cooperative with us

973
00:49:05,920 --> 00:49:00,840
he wasn't my asset I didn't recruit him

974
00:49:08,060 --> 00:49:05,930
but somebody down in in Arizona out of

975
00:49:09,740 --> 00:49:08,070
davis-monthan Air Force Base when the

976
00:49:13,340 --> 00:49:09,750
OSI agents down there recruited and was

977
00:49:17,210 --> 00:49:13,350
window Stevens no window was what yeah

978
00:49:18,440 --> 00:49:17,220
absolutely women was window would at at

979
00:49:21,589 --> 00:49:18,450
the UFO condemned

980
00:49:24,620 --> 00:49:21,599
tensions window would invite certain

981
00:49:27,829 --> 00:49:24,630
people up to his room and show us things

982
00:49:31,220 --> 00:49:27,839
that he had gotten from he wouldn't tell

983
00:49:33,680 --> 00:49:31,230
us who or some footage of something that

984
00:49:36,500 --> 00:49:33,690
he had gotten from somebody would never

985
00:49:38,450 --> 00:49:36,510
ever tell us and I don't know that that

986
00:49:40,370 --> 00:49:38,460
maybe OSI knew about it because he was

987
00:49:42,800 --> 00:49:40,380
being handled by somebody down in

988
00:49:48,079 --> 00:49:42,810
Arizona and I didn't have privy to that

989
00:49:51,349 --> 00:49:48,089
information because it pretty closely

990
00:49:55,790 --> 00:49:51,359
guarded its compartmented but he would

991
00:49:57,380 --> 00:49:55,800
always show us things and and we I walk

992
00:50:01,130 --> 00:49:57,390
away scratching my head like where did

993
00:50:03,560 --> 00:50:01,140
you get that but but Linda was I mean I

994
00:50:07,599 --> 00:50:03,570
could name some others but but they were

995
00:50:09,980 --> 00:50:07,609
they were oh and we call him cooperate

996
00:50:12,260 --> 00:50:09,990
cooperating people somebody would

997
00:50:15,550 --> 00:50:12,270
cooperate with us that they might not

998
00:50:18,500 --> 00:50:15,560
have given us everything we wanted but

999
00:50:20,660 --> 00:50:18,510
and I think window had been had of

1000
00:50:23,480 --> 00:50:20,670
course been in the Air Force and and and

1001
00:50:26,690 --> 00:50:23,490
and Wendell was he could relate to him

1002
00:50:29,180 --> 00:50:26,700
as being you know a former blue Souter

1003
00:50:31,660 --> 00:50:29,190
because he was Air Force right and he

1004
00:50:37,309 --> 00:50:31,670
would you know he would be more

1005
00:50:39,980 --> 00:50:37,319
forthcoming well let's get back to

1006
00:50:41,990 --> 00:50:39,990
Wendell Stevens in in just a bit let's

1007
00:50:49,190 --> 00:50:42,000
get let's go back to Bill Moore for a

1008
00:50:52,069 --> 00:50:49,200
second did the mj-12 documents did you

1009
00:50:52,520 --> 00:50:52,079
supply those to Bill Moore absolutely

1010
00:50:54,380 --> 00:50:52,530
not

1011
00:50:57,800 --> 00:50:54,390
where did he give me that work that's

1012
00:50:59,000 --> 00:50:57,810
been proven and and and disproven by I

1013
00:51:01,880 --> 00:50:59,010
mean I went through two FBI

1014
00:51:05,470 --> 00:51:01,890
investigations on that crap and III

1015
00:51:10,339 --> 00:51:05,480
think two polygraphs it I didn't do it I

1016
00:51:15,140 --> 00:51:10,349
don't know who did I I had my suspicions

1017
00:51:19,910 --> 00:51:15,150
but I can't prove it and I don't know

1018
00:51:23,120 --> 00:51:19,920
that the government knows but but I

1019
00:51:28,160 --> 00:51:23,130
didn't bill brought it brought him to me

1020
00:51:32,000 --> 00:51:28,170
and I told bill when I when he brought

1021
00:51:34,420 --> 00:51:32,010
him to me I said Bill I don't

1022
00:51:37,760 --> 00:51:34,430
babies - he said I can't tell you that

1023
00:51:40,010 --> 00:51:37,770
well shortly after this this Jamie Shan

1024
00:51:42,740 --> 00:51:40,020
Dara shows up right and I had never I'd

1025
00:51:43,340 --> 00:51:42,750
never met him I had anything to do with

1026
00:51:46,580 --> 00:51:43,350
him

1027
00:51:49,970 --> 00:51:46,590
well Jamie had a lot of contacts within

1028
00:51:53,090 --> 00:51:49,980
dia get names he would drop names of

1029
00:51:54,770 --> 00:51:53,100
people who I knew I wouldn't I wouldn't

1030
00:51:57,650 --> 00:51:54,780
acknowledge that I knew him

1031
00:51:59,360 --> 00:51:57,660
- Jamie but he would he would start

1032
00:52:01,190 --> 00:51:59,370
naming these people and I thought well

1033
00:52:03,740 --> 00:52:01,200
did you know and I started thinking

1034
00:52:04,600 --> 00:52:03,750
maybe he's an asset or maybe he's an

1035
00:52:07,520 --> 00:52:04,610
agent

1036
00:52:08,090 --> 00:52:07,530
Jamie's hand era the TV producer yeah

1037
00:52:16,700 --> 00:52:08,100
yeah

1038
00:52:18,230 --> 00:52:16,710
he looked ass said ish no and I've tried

1039
00:52:21,350 --> 00:52:18,240
to chase him down you know we live in

1040
00:52:23,930 --> 00:52:21,360
broadcast out of Burbank and that that

1041
00:52:25,820 --> 00:52:23,940
was him in bill Moore's headquarters for

1042
00:52:27,170 --> 00:52:25,830
a number of years was right here yeah

1043
00:52:29,150 --> 00:52:27,180
right

1044
00:52:32,060 --> 00:52:29,160
I I don't I don't know if he's still

1045
00:52:34,910 --> 00:52:32,070
alive I can't find any record I'm I

1046
00:52:36,440 --> 00:52:34,920
would love to talk to he's got to be

1047
00:52:39,490 --> 00:52:36,450
getting up there in years he would be

1048
00:52:48,620 --> 00:52:39,500
probably in his mid 80s I would think

1049
00:52:53,030 --> 00:52:48,630
well in 2000 since 2005 no 2006 he was

1050
00:52:54,830 --> 00:52:53,040
alive he showed up at the that when they

1051
00:53:00,110 --> 00:52:54,840
still had a UFO conventions in Laughlin

1052
00:53:02,090 --> 00:53:00,120
he showed up there with Bill Ryan and I

1053
00:53:04,040 --> 00:53:02,100
can't think of Bill Lyons girlfriend's

1054
00:53:06,470 --> 00:53:04,050
name but and I don't know if you know

1055
00:53:09,170 --> 00:53:06,480
them but anyway Terry Hannity Kerry

1056
00:53:12,260 --> 00:53:09,180
Cassidy there we go

1057
00:53:19,160 --> 00:53:12,270
she's a character she's a collector but

1058
00:53:20,900 --> 00:53:19,170
anyway anyways he showed up and I knew I

1059
00:53:24,470 --> 00:53:20,910
may just look at him and tell that he

1060
00:53:28,910 --> 00:53:24,480
was on some kind of either prescription

1061
00:53:31,670 --> 00:53:28,920
drug or illegal drugs he he just he

1062
00:53:35,180 --> 00:53:31,680
would rant about things that happened to

1063
00:53:37,570 --> 00:53:35,190
him he had marks on his body where he

1064
00:53:41,240 --> 00:53:37,580
claimed that he'd been on a beach at

1065
00:53:43,640 --> 00:53:41,250
some beaches in California and Navy

1066
00:53:45,650 --> 00:53:43,650
SEALs landed and took him in a

1067
00:53:48,620 --> 00:53:45,660
helicopter and took him to a

1068
00:53:51,550 --> 00:53:48,630
at Cornell Coronado Island and put him

1069
00:53:55,640 --> 00:53:51,560
in a brig and beat him because he saw

1070
00:53:57,740 --> 00:53:55,650
them training aliens and so I mean

1071
00:53:59,780 --> 00:53:57,750
that's that's just one of his many many

1072
00:54:01,610 --> 00:53:59,790
stories that he would tell but that was

1073
00:54:04,700 --> 00:54:01,620
last time I saw him so I had no idea

1074
00:54:07,810 --> 00:54:04,710
where Jamie would be now today now bill

1075
00:54:10,310 --> 00:54:07,820
more for four would seem like forever

1076
00:54:13,700 --> 00:54:10,320
going around to all the conferences and

1077
00:54:16,190 --> 00:54:13,710
the radio shows and next week just wait

1078
00:54:18,350 --> 00:54:16,200
I've got a new document I've got a new

1079
00:54:20,150 --> 00:54:18,360
letter I've got a new official Air Force

1080
00:54:23,690 --> 00:54:20,160
this I've got this and and I'm going

1081
00:54:25,760 --> 00:54:23,700
forward and it did it was a weekly or

1082
00:54:28,850 --> 00:54:25,770
monthly thing with bill more did you

1083
00:54:30,920 --> 00:54:28,860
supply him with those letters and

1084
00:54:35,180 --> 00:54:30,930
documents that he kept bringing forward

1085
00:54:37,280 --> 00:54:35,190
no where was he getting them from I you

1086
00:54:43,340 --> 00:54:37,290
know what Bill did his own thing he had

1087
00:54:46,970 --> 00:54:43,350
his own contacts and Bill was on his own

1088
00:54:48,830 --> 00:54:46,980
there's a lot of times he was he called

1089
00:54:52,850 --> 00:54:48,840
me once and told me he was going to do

1090
00:54:56,480 --> 00:54:52,860
it I'm not sure if it was a television

1091
00:54:59,000 --> 00:54:56,490
or radio show a political was in Seattle

1092
00:55:01,790 --> 00:54:59,010
and that's when his car was broken into

1093
00:55:05,180 --> 00:55:01,800
and there was a number of documents

1094
00:55:07,340 --> 00:55:05,190
stolen out of his briefcase and he

1095
00:55:08,810 --> 00:55:07,350
called me and told me about this

1096
00:55:10,940 --> 00:55:08,820
incident and I said bill what the heck

1097
00:55:13,190 --> 00:55:10,950
are you doing running around that kind

1098
00:55:14,990 --> 00:55:13,200
of documents are they and he told me he

1099
00:55:16,910 --> 00:55:15,000
said well the documents were given to me

1100
00:55:19,280 --> 00:55:16,920
by some other people I said who by who

1101
00:55:20,870 --> 00:55:19,290
he said oh I can't tell you that it's a

1102
00:55:24,050 --> 00:55:20,880
bill you running around doing this stuff

1103
00:55:28,130 --> 00:55:24,060
I I suggest you not do it don't do it

1104
00:55:34,190 --> 00:55:28,140
anymore but he still did it so and and

1105
00:55:38,300 --> 00:55:34,200
later on I think probably after 86 I

1106
00:55:40,850 --> 00:55:38,310
just broke off contact with him I didn't

1107
00:55:43,400 --> 00:55:40,860
actually terminate him as a asset on

1108
00:55:47,890 --> 00:55:43,410
paper but I just didn't

1109
00:55:52,720 --> 00:55:47,900
I listed him as a non-cooperative

1110
00:55:54,740 --> 00:55:52,730
asset so I didn't really believe or

1111
00:55:55,940 --> 00:55:54,750
collect information that he was

1112
00:55:58,040 --> 00:55:55,950
supplying and I don't think he'd

1113
00:55:58,609 --> 00:55:58,050
supplied much after that what did you

1114
00:56:06,920 --> 00:55:58,619
what do

1115
00:56:09,380 --> 00:56:06,930
you supply bill bill more yes as an

1116
00:56:11,390 --> 00:56:09,390
asset he's in the UFO community he's an

1117
00:56:15,410 --> 00:56:11,400
author he's a researcher he's a public

1118
00:56:18,200 --> 00:56:15,420
speaker and doing his and author books

1119
00:56:21,259 --> 00:56:18,210
what did you supply him that was disinfo

1120
00:56:22,069 --> 00:56:21,269
I didn't have to supply me anything that

1121
00:56:24,589 --> 00:56:22,079
was just simple

1122
00:56:28,489 --> 00:56:24,599
the problem with Bill Morris he was so

1123
00:56:32,089 --> 00:56:28,499
long so much involved in the UFO UFO

1124
00:56:35,989 --> 00:56:32,099
community before I ever met him in 1980

1125
00:56:38,089 --> 00:56:35,999
or 79 wonder what was that I couldn't I

1126
00:56:40,670 --> 00:56:38,099
couldn't dissing for himself

1127
00:56:43,819 --> 00:56:40,680
bill already knew and Bill could see

1128
00:56:46,160 --> 00:56:43,829
things and he and Bill had access yeah

1129
00:56:47,980 --> 00:56:46,170
and his own sources which I didn't find

1130
00:56:50,420 --> 00:56:47,990
out until years later he had a kernel

1131
00:56:53,630 --> 00:56:50,430
that was stationed at Norton Air Force

1132
00:56:59,150 --> 00:56:53,640
Base that was OSI and I didn't find this

1133
00:57:00,859 --> 00:56:59,160
out until 2001 or so but this this Air

1134
00:57:04,489 --> 00:57:00,869
Force OSI agent was given him

1135
00:57:08,870 --> 00:57:04,499
information now whether he was using him

1136
00:57:12,049 --> 00:57:08,880
to as a NASA I don't know but I never

1137
00:57:15,859 --> 00:57:12,059
gave Bill a thing any disinformation

1138
00:57:17,839 --> 00:57:15,869
because if I woulda tried bill would

1139
00:57:19,759 --> 00:57:17,849
have doubted me he would have caught

1140
00:57:22,130 --> 00:57:19,769
said I don't want to I don't want to

1141
00:57:23,930 --> 00:57:22,140
muddy the waters I'm already good with

1142
00:57:25,910 --> 00:57:23,940
these people if I bring something in

1143
00:57:27,529 --> 00:57:25,920
that's not true and there's so many

1144
00:57:29,870 --> 00:57:27,539
other people that figure it out it's not

1145
00:57:31,759 --> 00:57:29,880
true then my credibility's down the

1146
00:57:35,210 --> 00:57:31,769
drain so so we didn't do that with Bill

1147
00:57:38,420 --> 00:57:35,220
well why did you're calling him an asset

1148
00:57:43,009 --> 00:57:38,430
though what did he do for you he

1149
00:57:45,859 --> 00:57:43,019
reported to us well I'm the Soviet thing

1150
00:57:47,870 --> 00:57:45,869
that's entirely the county espionage

1151
00:57:50,809 --> 00:57:47,880
operation that he was he was involved

1152
00:57:53,809 --> 00:57:50,819
with which I'm not even to go to details

1153
00:57:56,539 --> 00:57:53,819
on that he was doing that and plus he

1154
00:57:59,470 --> 00:57:56,549
was members of UFO group he would tell

1155
00:58:01,970 --> 00:57:59,480
us what they were doing

1156
00:58:03,559 --> 00:58:01,980
hey would they had a meeting they

1157
00:58:06,440 --> 00:58:03,569
discussed all these different sightings

1158
00:58:08,720 --> 00:58:06,450
so-and-so is in charge so so does the

1159
00:58:12,049 --> 00:58:08,730
field investigator here's the phone

1160
00:58:12,529 --> 00:58:12,059
numbers here's how many field reports

1161
00:58:14,269 --> 00:58:12,539
they did

1162
00:58:15,919 --> 00:58:14,279
and things like that that's what he

1163
00:58:20,509 --> 00:58:15,929
reported back to us and why was that

1164
00:58:22,640 --> 00:58:20,519
important to the Air Force to keep track

1165
00:58:25,729 --> 00:58:22,650
of the UFO community to keep track of

1166
00:58:29,630 --> 00:58:25,739
what they were doing because the the

1167
00:58:31,400 --> 00:58:29,640
more eyes in ears you have in the

1168
00:58:34,130 --> 00:58:31,410
intelligence community that better it's

1169
00:58:36,620 --> 00:58:34,140
going to be if you have a thousand

1170
00:58:38,479 --> 00:58:36,630
people reporting back to us on what

1171
00:58:41,209 --> 00:58:38,489
they're doing what they're seeing and

1172
00:58:43,279 --> 00:58:41,219
what's occurring in their area then

1173
00:58:44,659 --> 00:58:43,289
that's that's better for the United

1174
00:58:46,579 --> 00:58:44,669
States that's better for national

1175
00:58:50,179 --> 00:58:46,589
security because we can keep track then

1176
00:58:52,729 --> 00:58:50,189
of what's occurring now yeah ninety

1177
00:58:54,859 --> 00:58:52,739
percent of everything that Bill's

1178
00:58:59,120 --> 00:58:54,869
reporting as far as reports is that a

1179
00:59:01,699 --> 00:58:59,130
pro or or newfound was was receiving was

1180
00:59:04,099 --> 00:59:01,709
probably fully explainable because

1181
00:59:06,380 --> 00:59:04,109
remember in that time period we didn't

1182
00:59:09,589 --> 00:59:06,390
have Project Blue Book anymore

1183
00:59:15,559 --> 00:59:09,599
so we had we still weren't interested in

1184
00:59:18,380 --> 00:59:15,569
in reports and of sightings of of object

1185
00:59:21,199 --> 00:59:18,390
and and some of them could be Soviet or

1186
00:59:23,449 --> 00:59:21,209
could be hostile so that's why we were

1187
00:59:25,549 --> 00:59:23,459
doing it as part of a big plan it was

1188
00:59:27,049 --> 00:59:25,559
just not it was all over the United

1189
00:59:30,859 --> 00:59:27,059
States like all over the world we were

1190
00:59:33,890 --> 00:59:30,869
doing this trying to keep track of what

1191
00:59:38,509 --> 00:59:33,900
was occurring that we we the Air Force

1192
00:59:40,489 --> 00:59:38,519
didn't know were you there when he did

1193
00:59:43,699 --> 00:59:40,499
the you know did the speech where he

1194
00:59:47,959 --> 00:59:43,709
came clean and ran out the back door in

1195
00:59:52,519 --> 00:59:47,969
Las Vegas 1991 no I wasn't there you

1196
00:59:58,489 --> 00:59:52,529
were there but little told me Bill I met

1197
01:00:01,159 --> 00:59:58,499
bill in in Laughlin before this because

1198
01:00:03,499 --> 01:00:01,169
it was in Vegas but I bet we met in

1199
01:00:07,339 --> 01:00:03,509
Laughlin and Bill told me what he was

1200
01:00:12,829 --> 01:00:07,349
going to do and I we dropped him in

1201
01:00:14,689 --> 01:00:12,839
probably 88 or 87 or I'm not sure we

1202
01:00:16,309 --> 01:00:14,699
dropped you we just told him no more I'm

1203
01:00:19,039 --> 01:00:16,319
not gonna pay you for travel or pay you

1204
01:00:21,049 --> 01:00:19,049
for anything so it's over with and he

1205
01:00:23,899 --> 01:00:21,059
said okay and reporting on his stances

1206
01:00:26,210 --> 01:00:23,909
and then he he then I I had contact with

1207
01:00:28,720 --> 01:00:26,220
him occasionally here and there and

1208
01:00:31,900 --> 01:00:28,730
and we met in Laughlin I think it was

1209
01:00:34,400 --> 01:00:31,910
two or three days before that the Vegas

1210
01:00:38,080 --> 01:00:34,410
speech and he told me exactly what it's

1211
01:00:45,920 --> 01:00:38,090
gonna do and he said and he was he was

1212
01:00:48,710 --> 01:00:45,930
quite irritating to me of because he

1213
01:00:51,980 --> 01:00:48,720
said I'm gonna do this and nobody's

1214
01:00:55,940 --> 01:00:51,990
gonna change my mind and he gave me a

1215
01:00:57,290 --> 01:00:55,950
draft of his speech and I looked at it

1216
01:00:58,730 --> 01:00:57,300
and I said you know there's a lot of

1217
01:01:00,589 --> 01:00:58,740
things in here bill I wouldn't suggest

1218
01:01:02,690 --> 01:01:00,599
you he said I don't care what you say

1219
01:01:04,670 --> 01:01:02,700
I'm gonna do it I said fine bill you

1220
01:01:07,970 --> 01:01:04,680
know I'm not gonna stop you you want to

1221
01:01:16,160 --> 01:01:07,980
do it do it and he did how much did you

1222
01:01:21,070 --> 01:01:16,170
income how much did you pay bill more we

1223
01:01:27,650 --> 01:01:24,130
mostly we'll pay for just travel or

1224
01:01:33,970 --> 01:01:27,660
expenses but we didn't actually pay him

1225
01:01:43,880 --> 01:01:39,050
pardon - yeah yeah - always gonna sign

1226
01:01:48,200 --> 01:01:43,890
for it okay as a form and you signed for

1227
01:01:50,210 --> 01:01:48,210
it and then we he signs the IRS form -

1228
01:01:53,120 --> 01:01:50,220
so you know there's two forms he had

1229
01:01:56,150 --> 01:01:53,130
signed but it was never a lot of money I

1230
01:01:59,829 --> 01:01:56,160
mean I don't think I ever ever paid me

1231
01:02:04,250 --> 01:01:59,839
more than $45 $50 or something like that

1232
01:02:06,560 --> 01:02:04,260
$30 so why do it yeah I mean I mean for

1233
01:02:09,500 --> 01:02:06,570
Bill why do it I mean I I don't I don't

1234
01:02:11,480 --> 01:02:09,510
know I and you know and today he's a

1235
01:02:13,640 --> 01:02:11,490
he's a janitor for a junior high school

1236
01:02:15,859 --> 01:02:13,650
in Pennsylvania living in a trailer you

1237
01:02:20,210 --> 01:02:15,869
know why I mean why why go down that

1238
01:02:22,250 --> 01:02:20,220
road how many others and I'm gonna

1239
01:02:24,050 --> 01:02:22,260
apologize to the network and all of our

1240
01:02:25,910 --> 01:02:24,060
sponsors I've blown through all of the

1241
01:02:28,910 --> 01:02:25,920
commercials but and I've never done this

1242
01:02:31,280 --> 01:02:28,920
before I'll pay the price for this in

1243
01:02:33,800 --> 01:02:31,290
the future okay so that those phone

1244
01:02:37,599 --> 01:02:33,810
calls are coming in tomorrow how many

1245
01:02:38,960 --> 01:02:37,609
other asses did you have in in ethology

1246
01:02:44,780 --> 01:02:38,970
there was

1247
01:02:47,690 --> 01:02:44,790
more how many others personally me

1248
01:02:50,210 --> 01:02:47,700
personally oh there I had ok let's talk

1249
01:02:51,680 --> 01:02:50,220
here well let's do you personally first

1250
01:03:02,330 --> 01:02:51,690
because that you would know that

1251
01:03:05,090 --> 01:03:02,340
directly how many I had I had three do I

1252
01:03:09,470 --> 01:03:05,100
and this was just in New Mexico area do

1253
01:03:11,690 --> 01:03:09,480
I know those three well Bill Moore being

1254
01:03:14,750 --> 01:03:11,700
one of them no I'm sorry I'm sorry I'm

1255
01:03:17,060 --> 01:03:14,760
sorry uh for bill would be one and then

1256
01:03:20,510 --> 01:03:17,070
it would be three others um one of them

1257
01:03:25,880 --> 01:03:20,520
dead one of them died many many years

1258
01:03:27,770 --> 01:03:25,890
ago and the other two are still I don't

1259
01:03:30,590 --> 01:03:27,780
know that they're involved in the UFO

1260
01:03:34,910 --> 01:03:30,600
community one was a pro and one was new

1261
01:03:36,170 --> 01:03:34,920
fun right in in the southwest area and

1262
01:03:37,910 --> 01:03:36,180
I'm not gonna disclose their names

1263
01:03:40,730 --> 01:03:37,920
nothing you don't have to you don't have

1264
01:03:43,760 --> 01:03:40,740
to okay if I don't know them and it's a

1265
01:03:47,390 --> 01:03:43,770
pro and it's MUFON and and they're older

1266
01:03:49,760 --> 01:03:47,400
now and and not involved okay now what

1267
01:03:53,150 --> 01:03:49,770
about the Air Force in general

1268
01:03:56,450 --> 01:03:53,160
did they have if you had yours certainly

1269
01:03:58,760 --> 01:03:56,460
there were others under the control of

1270
01:04:02,600 --> 01:03:58,770
the Air Force can you put a number on

1271
01:04:05,210 --> 01:04:02,610
that well you figured there was 122 Air

1272
01:04:08,720 --> 01:04:05,220
Force OSI agents that weren't involved

1273
01:04:11,270 --> 01:04:08,730
in this program there were 122 that had

1274
01:04:11,960 --> 01:04:11,280
been briefed and that's worldwide that I

1275
01:04:21,200 --> 01:04:11,970
knew of

1276
01:04:24,830 --> 01:04:21,210
out of those 122 every one of them was

1277
01:04:26,870 --> 01:04:24,840
required to have assets and up to three

1278
01:04:29,900 --> 01:04:26,880
or four so you do the math there were

1279
01:04:33,050 --> 01:04:29,910
quite a few I don't know names I don't

1280
01:04:36,260 --> 01:04:33,060
know numbers exactly now after all the

1281
01:04:42,380 --> 01:04:36,270
years but I know that I know one

1282
01:04:45,530 --> 01:04:42,390
particular asset who it was probably one

1283
01:04:49,640 --> 01:04:45,540
of the better ones was one of the senior

1284
01:04:52,400 --> 01:04:49,650
officials and April I mean that new fund

1285
01:04:52,580 --> 01:04:52,410
I think he was an a pro and MUFON but he

1286
01:05:03,770 --> 01:04:52,590
was

1287
01:05:05,450 --> 01:05:03,780
involved I knew because the agent that

1288
01:05:08,960 --> 01:05:05,460
was handling I'm always bragged about

1289
01:05:11,030 --> 01:05:08,970
how he recruited this guy and you know

1290
01:05:13,010 --> 01:05:11,040
he was one of the senior directors and

1291
01:05:15,500 --> 01:05:13,020
and he was getting all sorts of

1292
01:05:18,680 --> 01:05:15,510
information from him so I knew there was

1293
01:05:21,740 --> 01:05:18,690
some at least one senior official on our

1294
01:05:25,220 --> 01:05:21,750
side and and I understand the collecting

1295
01:05:28,280 --> 01:05:25,230
of of information from inside of these

1296
01:05:32,050 --> 01:05:28,290
organizations going out but what about

1297
01:05:35,480 --> 01:05:32,060
the the disinformation going back into

1298
01:05:40,810 --> 01:05:35,490
these organizations be it rumor be it

1299
01:05:46,850 --> 01:05:40,820
photographs documents or just stories

1300
01:05:48,260 --> 01:05:46,860
did that occur no we were specifically

1301
01:05:50,750 --> 01:05:48,270
you know that's right

1302
01:05:54,500 --> 01:05:50,760
that's some pretty strong no coming out

1303
01:05:58,940 --> 01:05:54,510
of you yeah absolutely not we were not

1304
01:06:02,150 --> 01:05:58,950
allowed we were specifically forbidden

1305
01:06:06,910 --> 01:06:02,160
to do that unless there was some type of

1306
01:06:12,770 --> 01:06:06,920
operation that specifically targeted a

1307
01:06:16,040 --> 01:06:12,780
particular incident such as if you mean

1308
01:06:18,260 --> 01:06:16,050
I'll give you an example if John Smith

1309
01:06:20,120 --> 01:06:18,270
is driving down a road and the UFO lands

1310
01:06:23,870 --> 01:06:20,130
next to him and shuts his vehicle off

1311
01:06:28,400 --> 01:06:23,880
and and the only person that has gained

1312
01:06:30,260 --> 01:06:28,410
any knowledge about this UFO was the

1313
01:06:34,220 --> 01:06:30,270
field investigator for a MUFON or a

1314
01:06:36,110 --> 01:06:34,230
parole and so they do a report and they

1315
01:06:39,590 --> 01:06:36,120
don't send it to anybody but they keep

1316
01:06:40,900 --> 01:06:39,600
it in but our asset within that a pro or

1317
01:06:44,540 --> 01:06:40,910
new find

1318
01:06:49,850 --> 01:06:44,550
gives it to us now we're gonna start an

1319
01:06:51,550 --> 01:06:49,860
investigation and now maybe we would try

1320
01:06:55,310 --> 01:06:51,560
some kind of counterintelligence

1321
01:06:58,010 --> 01:06:55,320
operation against the person not not not

1322
01:07:01,240 --> 01:06:58,020
the field investigator not the group but

1323
01:07:03,620 --> 01:07:01,250
but the person that had the encounter

1324
01:07:05,090 --> 01:07:03,630
that's the only time you would be

1325
01:07:06,620 --> 01:07:05,100
allowed to do something like that

1326
01:07:15,160 --> 01:07:06,630
does

1327
01:07:17,930 --> 01:07:15,170
assets right now inside of MUFON I I

1328
01:07:21,740 --> 01:07:17,940
left an 88 I have no idea

1329
01:07:25,100 --> 01:07:21,750
oh okay you can imagine that they do do

1330
01:07:29,840 --> 01:07:25,110
you now do you still communicate at all

1331
01:07:33,230 --> 01:07:29,850
with anybody in the Air Force OSI we

1332
01:07:36,200 --> 01:07:33,240
have a group of retired Association of

1333
01:07:38,020 --> 01:07:36,210
Retired intelligence officers and within

1334
01:07:42,470 --> 01:07:38,030
that group there's a there's another

1335
01:07:45,410 --> 01:07:42,480
smaller group that all of us had been

1336
01:07:47,750 --> 01:07:45,420
involved in that program and there

1337
01:07:49,850 --> 01:07:47,760
wasn't just OSI it was something some

1338
01:07:53,920 --> 01:07:49,860
guys have been FBI they've been briefed

1339
01:07:58,310 --> 01:07:53,930
into a dia and we have a few CIA

1340
01:07:59,990 --> 01:07:58,320
officers and we meet annually or

1341
01:08:05,600 --> 01:08:00,000
sometimes semi-annually and there's

1342
01:08:08,480 --> 01:08:05,610
there's about 52 left there's a lot more

1343
01:08:11,750 --> 01:08:08,490
years ago but they died off and and we

1344
01:08:13,730 --> 01:08:11,760
still meet and we sit and talk and none

1345
01:08:15,230 --> 01:08:13,740
of us are involved none of us have

1346
01:08:20,140 --> 01:08:15,240
security clearances anymore

1347
01:08:23,900 --> 01:08:20,150
none of us have access to anything but

1348
01:08:27,800 --> 01:08:23,910
others tell us things and we have ways

1349
01:08:31,250 --> 01:08:27,810
of obtaining information and we need and

1350
01:08:35,680 --> 01:08:31,260
we talk about it and I know that there's

1351
01:08:38,690 --> 01:08:35,690
probably a good intelligence network

1352
01:08:42,170 --> 01:08:38,700
still alive just like the way we had it

1353
01:08:44,570 --> 01:08:42,180
and maybe even better than we had it did

1354
01:08:48,710 --> 01:08:44,580
you I think you've talked about this in

1355
01:08:52,240 --> 01:08:48,720
the past but did you did you operate

1356
01:09:01,520 --> 01:08:52,250
undercover did you go to these meetings

1357
01:09:04,370 --> 01:09:01,530
as a civilian I would go to I have yes I

1358
01:09:08,599 --> 01:09:04,380
have I have I've gone through some UFO

1359
01:09:14,200 --> 01:09:08,609
conventions back in the 80s not as as

1360
01:09:24,390 --> 01:09:17,249
man do you feel strange admitting that

1361
01:09:29,410 --> 01:09:24,400
today does it feel a little dirty if I'm

1362
01:09:31,749 --> 01:09:29,420
I'm it do I feel strange air force that

1363
01:09:33,760 --> 01:09:31,759
mean what we I mean you know it's

1364
01:09:36,309 --> 01:09:33,770
clandestine it's inside of the United

1365
01:09:39,220 --> 01:09:36,319
States you're met you know you're you're

1366
01:09:43,209 --> 01:09:39,230
in the Air Force and then going to a UFO

1367
01:09:46,690 --> 01:09:43,219
convention or conference or at dresses a

1368
01:09:49,030 --> 01:09:46,700
civilian and and going in and doing that

1369
01:09:53,249 --> 01:09:49,040
on US soil you know we're not enemy

1370
01:09:57,490 --> 01:09:53,259
combatants here we're American citizens

1371
01:10:00,870 --> 01:09:57,500
well well I'm doing all I did was sit

1372
01:10:04,810 --> 01:10:00,880
and listen I did I didn't do anything

1373
01:10:08,050 --> 01:10:04,820
clandestine or undercover I mean I sat

1374
01:10:10,270 --> 01:10:08,060
there and listen to the speakers and and

1375
01:10:13,090 --> 01:10:10,280
and maybe mingled with some people and

1376
01:10:19,380 --> 01:10:13,100
listened to some some people talk or

1377
01:10:23,590 --> 01:10:19,390
something like that but legal anything

1378
01:10:26,200 --> 01:10:23,600
and and you're talking about dresses to

1379
01:10:28,300 --> 01:10:26,210
being undercover I were civilian clothes

1380
01:10:30,850 --> 01:10:28,310
the entire time I wasn't on the side

1381
01:10:31,720 --> 01:10:30,860
I mean you we didn't wear uniforms what

1382
01:10:33,190 --> 01:10:31,730
that's what I'm saying

1383
01:10:34,810 --> 01:10:33,200
well that's Richard that's what I'm

1384
01:10:37,660 --> 01:10:34,820
saying you didn't tell anybody that you

1385
01:10:40,270 --> 01:10:37,670
were in the Air Force and that you

1386
01:10:41,650 --> 01:10:40,280
worked for the OSI he didn't you know

1387
01:10:44,860 --> 01:10:41,660
you didn't disclose that at those

1388
01:10:48,220 --> 01:10:44,870
meetings either yeah now now what about

1389
01:10:50,350 --> 01:10:48,230
others I did no no I did I have I had to

1390
01:10:51,880 --> 01:10:50,360
disclose it to my supervisor in fact I

1391
01:10:54,310 --> 01:10:51,890
was directed to go that's your

1392
01:10:57,430 --> 01:10:54,320
supervisor I'm talking about the people

1393
01:11:00,130 --> 01:10:57,440
the civilians at the conferences they

1394
01:11:03,280 --> 01:11:00,140
didn't oh yeah yeah no no they didn't

1395
01:11:09,910 --> 01:11:03,290
know right right now what about those

1396
01:11:11,470 --> 01:11:09,920
other 120 122 that were in this program

1397
01:11:13,690 --> 01:11:11,480
with you in the Air Force that was

1398
01:11:15,070 --> 01:11:13,700
around the world but certainly a chunk

1399
01:11:17,320 --> 01:11:15,080
of them were inside of the United States

1400
01:11:20,770 --> 01:11:17,330
they were doing the exact same thing

1401
01:11:23,890 --> 01:11:20,780
weren't they yes that is a massive

1402
01:11:28,150 --> 01:11:23,900
infiltration massive I don't know who to

1403
01:11:32,650 --> 01:11:28,160
trust right well you know what am I

1404
01:11:35,310 --> 01:11:32,660
just it wasn't just oh s I officer Navy

1405
01:11:39,630 --> 01:11:35,320
intelligence had their own rifle right

1406
01:11:45,370 --> 01:11:39,640
yeah yeah I had a FB I had a really

1407
01:11:47,800 --> 01:11:45,380
expensive Network and and I don't know

1408
01:11:50,440 --> 01:11:47,810
about the army I know I know OSI and

1409
01:11:55,200 --> 01:11:50,450
Navy I don't know about them I can't

1410
01:11:58,690 --> 01:11:55,210
speak for the army and it's gotta be

1411
01:12:00,700 --> 01:11:58,700
well see you know as you know I speak at

1412
01:12:03,910 --> 01:12:00,710
these conferences some of them are

1413
01:12:07,030 --> 01:12:03,920
really really large you can't you can't

1414
01:12:11,760 --> 01:12:07,040
know everybody that is attending but

1415
01:12:14,740 --> 01:12:11,770
I've often suspected that there must be

1416
01:12:16,870 --> 01:12:14,750
some of them out there you don't know

1417
01:12:18,880 --> 01:12:16,880
that they could be women or men or young

1418
01:12:21,070 --> 01:12:18,890
oh you just don't know that's the first

1419
01:12:22,720 --> 01:12:21,080
thing but the second thing is these

1420
01:12:26,940 --> 01:12:22,730
presenters and these people that are

1421
01:12:29,950 --> 01:12:26,950
around me that we are friends and and

1422
01:12:33,910 --> 01:12:29,960
compatriots right but are you saying

1423
01:12:41,560 --> 01:12:33,920
that some of them may be assets because

1424
01:12:46,500 --> 01:12:41,570
that's what you did I was yes I would

1425
01:12:49,780 --> 01:12:46,510
say that every UFO group is has probably

1426
01:12:52,860 --> 01:12:49,790
assets belonging to some kind of

1427
01:12:58,510 --> 01:12:52,870
intelligence agency whether it would be

1428
01:13:00,790 --> 01:12:58,520
OSI FBI or whoever and and they're

1429
01:13:03,760 --> 01:13:00,800
reporting back what the group is doing

1430
01:13:08,170 --> 01:13:03,770
yes III don't know that for a fact I've

1431
01:13:10,720 --> 01:13:08,180
been out 30-some years so I can't say

1432
01:13:12,850 --> 01:13:10,730
for sure but I would I would guess it

1433
01:13:18,450 --> 01:13:12,860
probably is still happening

1434
01:13:23,140 --> 01:13:18,460
is there somebody today on the circuit

1435
01:13:32,410 --> 01:13:23,150
that you knew from back then that was an

1436
01:13:34,750 --> 01:13:32,420
asset oh yes people really that i I

1437
01:13:38,140 --> 01:13:34,760
don't need I don't I don't I need to

1438
01:13:40,360 --> 01:13:38,150
sleep tonight so I don't need names no

1439
01:13:42,070 --> 01:13:40,370
I'm not gonna tell you there are two

1440
01:13:44,290 --> 01:13:42,080
people one

1441
01:13:47,560 --> 01:13:44,300
one more prominent than the other of

1442
01:13:49,510 --> 01:13:47,570
there one is probably I don't I don't

1443
01:13:52,240 --> 01:13:49,520
have him to contract the one but the one

1444
01:13:55,870 --> 01:13:52,250
is you hear about him within the UFO

1445
01:13:58,210 --> 01:13:55,880
community now and then is involved it

1446
01:14:00,940 --> 01:13:58,220
was was an asset and probably said I

1447
01:14:04,330 --> 01:14:00,950
don't know if he still is or not and the

1448
01:14:07,390 --> 01:14:04,340
other person I I don't know but they

1449
01:14:12,160 --> 01:14:07,400
were and and I I would imagine that

1450
01:14:16,360 --> 01:14:12,170
there still are I can in fact I well the

1451
01:14:19,720 --> 01:14:16,370
last UFO convinced I was at 2010 the

1452
01:14:22,420 --> 01:14:19,730
last one window was that I pointed out

1453
01:14:25,660 --> 01:14:22,430
to window and some others in this group

1454
01:14:28,240 --> 01:14:25,670
right of who I knew in the audience that

1455
01:14:30,400 --> 01:14:28,250
were either CIA or Air Force I pointed

1456
01:14:31,840 --> 01:14:30,410
him out right there one two three and

1457
01:14:34,110 --> 01:14:31,850
there was something like six of them

1458
01:14:40,650 --> 01:14:34,120
they were scattered around the room and

1459
01:14:44,020 --> 01:14:40,660
I remember when George Knapp did his

1460
01:14:46,570 --> 01:14:44,030
Skywalker Ranch a presentation at UFO

1461
01:14:49,720 --> 01:14:46,580
convention in Laughlin and I don't

1462
01:14:52,450 --> 01:14:49,730
remember what years mm whatever five or

1463
01:15:00,550 --> 01:14:52,460
six or whatever it was I was there and

1464
01:15:03,580 --> 01:15:00,560
there were 20 20 that their intelligence

1465
01:15:12,370 --> 01:15:03,590
personnel in that room 20 and I knew

1466
01:15:16,930 --> 01:15:12,380
every single one of them the the the the

1467
01:15:21,160 --> 01:15:16,940
I just the community the UFO community

1468
01:15:22,600 --> 01:15:21,170
is so freaked out about this not for

1469
01:15:25,540 --> 01:15:22,610
about what you're saying I'm saying that

1470
01:15:27,670 --> 01:15:25,550
this could be occurring and you know

1471
01:15:29,500 --> 01:15:27,680
that this is something that you can

1472
01:15:31,510 --> 01:15:29,510
almost touch and feel when you go to

1473
01:15:34,000 --> 01:15:31,520
these conferences everybody is aware

1474
01:15:35,140 --> 01:15:34,010
they're looking for the feds right

1475
01:15:38,830 --> 01:15:35,150
they're looking for the event they're

1476
01:15:42,340 --> 01:15:38,840
looking because trust in this community

1477
01:15:45,130 --> 01:15:42,350
is is paramount Richard and you know

1478
01:15:48,240 --> 01:15:45,140
this you've done this for years trust is

1479
01:15:52,600 --> 01:15:48,250
there and everybody is suspicious and

1480
01:15:54,300 --> 01:15:52,610
and now you are saying that yes this has

1481
01:15:56,860 --> 01:15:54,310
been going on

1482
01:16:01,570 --> 01:15:56,870
the amount of numbers which you just

1483
01:16:02,440 --> 01:16:01,580
told me if every of 122 agents with four

1484
01:16:08,860 --> 01:16:02,450
assets

1485
01:16:12,010 --> 01:16:08,870
each we're looking at 500 505 lat that

1486
01:16:14,860 --> 01:16:12,020
is a big chunk of people that's a that's

1487
01:16:17,320 --> 01:16:14,870
a large number so when you go to these

1488
01:16:18,720 --> 01:16:17,330
conferences you've you don't know who to

1489
01:16:21,040 --> 01:16:18,730
trust

1490
01:16:23,620 --> 01:16:21,050
well that was back in the eighties I

1491
01:16:26,380 --> 01:16:23,630
can't speak for what how many there are

1492
01:16:28,690 --> 01:16:26,390
now but I would guess I mean just just

1493
01:16:30,250 --> 01:16:28,700
common sense tells you that the

1494
01:16:33,040 --> 01:16:30,260
government's gonna be keeping track of

1495
01:16:34,900 --> 01:16:33,050
it I mean and they're not violating any

1496
01:16:37,120 --> 01:16:34,910
laws they're just they're listening what

1497
01:16:40,560 --> 01:16:37,130
you're saying what what the speakers are

1498
01:16:44,020 --> 01:16:40,570
saying they're not they're not trying to

1499
01:16:45,880 --> 01:16:44,030
convince anybody of anything and we

1500
01:16:48,100 --> 01:16:45,890
never did we went to the conventions and

1501
01:16:50,680 --> 01:16:48,110
we were there to listen and listen to

1502
01:16:51,790 --> 01:16:50,690
what their speakers were saying and you

1503
01:16:54,400 --> 01:16:51,800
know some of them we found very

1504
01:16:56,470 --> 01:16:54,410
interesting and and then we report back

1505
01:17:00,370 --> 01:16:56,480
do a report back they hey we went to

1506
01:17:03,910 --> 01:17:00,380
this UFO convention and and and we and

1507
01:17:05,950 --> 01:17:03,920
so many this speakers spoke about this

1508
01:17:08,380 --> 01:17:05,960
this guy lectured about this so on so

1509
01:17:11,680 --> 01:17:08,390
it's also it's also and and that's it

1510
01:17:15,160 --> 01:17:11,690
that's it but we had we didn't you know

1511
01:17:16,750 --> 01:17:15,170
tap any rooms or wiretap we would be

1512
01:17:19,330 --> 01:17:16,760
prohibited from doing anything like that

1513
01:17:22,480 --> 01:17:19,340
we never did anything illegal we did we

1514
01:17:25,870 --> 01:17:22,490
just had their listened yes III think

1515
01:17:33,040 --> 01:17:25,880
that I think the UFO community they

1516
01:17:34,000 --> 01:17:33,050
don't have anything to hide and they

1517
01:17:37,450 --> 01:17:34,010
wouldn't have anything to lose by

1518
01:17:40,870 --> 01:17:37,460
sitting in a room with with 50

1519
01:17:44,800 --> 01:17:40,880
intelligence officers and lecturing to a

1520
01:17:45,640 --> 01:17:44,810
crowd of 5,000 with 50 in the room what

1521
01:17:48,430 --> 01:17:45,650
difference would it make

1522
01:17:50,620 --> 01:17:48,440
well but but that's that's the

1523
01:17:52,630 --> 01:17:50,630
interesting part for me when you're

1524
01:17:54,670 --> 01:17:52,640
suggesting that you know the

1525
01:17:56,020 --> 01:17:54,680
infiltration is there the assets are

1526
01:17:59,020 --> 01:17:56,030
there they're inside of the community

1527
01:18:02,830 --> 01:17:59,030
reporting back to you and the other

1528
01:18:05,140 --> 01:18:02,840
agents these are these are agents with

1529
01:18:06,670 --> 01:18:05,150
the career they're getting paid and they

1530
01:18:09,580 --> 01:18:06,680
have a job to do and the

1531
01:18:12,670 --> 01:18:09,590
these assets after hanging out at an

1532
01:18:16,150 --> 01:18:12,680
after party or this or picking up the

1533
01:18:18,160 --> 01:18:16,160
phone and calling their handler saying

1534
01:18:20,080 --> 01:18:18,170
okay this happened at the conference

1535
01:18:21,880 --> 01:18:20,090
today so-and-so said this somebody had

1536
01:18:25,360 --> 01:18:21,890
this so many had this photograph of the

1537
01:18:27,280 --> 01:18:25,370
and if that is going on that is nuts and

1538
01:18:31,330 --> 01:18:27,290
that's exactly what you're saying

1539
01:18:34,570 --> 01:18:31,340
happened right well I don't I can't say

1540
01:18:36,910 --> 01:18:34,580
that I can't say I can't speak for

1541
01:18:38,380 --> 01:18:36,920
anybody but myself I can't speak for any

1542
01:18:40,360 --> 01:18:38,390
of these other agents of what they were

1543
01:18:42,160 --> 01:18:40,370
getting or how much information they

1544
01:18:47,110 --> 01:18:42,170
were getting whether they were getting

1545
01:18:50,740 --> 01:18:47,120
documents or reports or photographs it

1546
01:18:53,230 --> 01:18:50,750
wasn't as as prevalent as you might make

1547
01:18:57,940 --> 01:18:53,240
it sound to be there there wasn't some

1548
01:19:01,270 --> 01:18:57,950
kind of a repository where were

1549
01:19:03,790 --> 01:19:01,280
thousands of pages of information coming

1550
01:19:05,400 --> 01:19:03,800
out of these UFOs groups was being filed

1551
01:19:11,170 --> 01:19:05,410
it wasn't like that

1552
01:19:15,580 --> 01:19:11,180
very very in fact bill Moore didn't give

1553
01:19:20,230 --> 01:19:15,590
a whole lot of information and or the

1554
01:19:21,850 --> 01:19:20,240
other assets I had some gave me stuff

1555
01:19:25,870 --> 01:19:21,860
that I was already printed in a

1556
01:19:28,840 --> 01:19:25,880
newspaper or a magazine or or I listened

1557
01:19:31,540 --> 01:19:28,850
to on a radio or was in a newspaper or a

1558
01:19:34,420 --> 01:19:31,550
television report so wasn't any kind of

1559
01:19:37,150 --> 01:19:34,430
Secrets that was occurring within the

1560
01:19:39,280 --> 01:19:37,160
UFO community was stuff that they all

1561
01:19:42,040 --> 01:19:39,290
would call me and say hey you know we

1562
01:19:44,260 --> 01:19:42,050
took four reports yesterday or last week

1563
01:19:47,710 --> 01:19:44,270
or last month or six months ago about

1564
01:19:49,840 --> 01:19:47,720
these sightings that occurred in in Las

1565
01:19:52,750 --> 01:19:49,850
Cruces New Mexico or Silver City or

1566
01:19:55,000 --> 01:19:52,760
wherever I would say okay

1567
01:19:57,610 --> 01:19:55,010
and I would our probably already know a

1568
01:20:00,460 --> 01:19:57,620
lot of it so I can only speak for myself

1569
01:20:03,580 --> 01:20:00,470
about what I was getting from these

1570
01:20:06,670 --> 01:20:03,590
assets okay two quick questions and I'm

1571
01:20:08,950 --> 01:20:06,680
gonna thank you in advance for for this

1572
01:20:11,890 --> 01:20:08,960
surprise visit number one number two for

1573
01:20:14,590 --> 01:20:11,900
for allowing me to drill you these

1574
01:20:16,690 --> 01:20:14,600
questions for the last hour and a half I

1575
01:20:18,760 --> 01:20:16,700
didn't expect this and and again I

1576
01:20:20,709 --> 01:20:18,770
apologize to all of our sponsors on the

1577
01:20:23,330 --> 01:20:20,719
show and the network

1578
01:20:24,950 --> 01:20:23,340
for neglecting my commercial breaks I

1579
01:20:26,750 --> 01:20:24,960
sure hope you don't get in trouble hey

1580
01:20:28,970 --> 01:20:26,760
you know what you know what Richards

1581
01:20:32,479 --> 01:20:28,980
some things have to be you know it's it

1582
01:20:39,290 --> 01:20:32,489
is what it is okay first question

1583
01:20:43,310 --> 01:20:39,300
the aviary fictitious created it was

1584
01:20:46,790 --> 01:20:43,320
created by somebody else I in fact that

1585
01:20:50,540 --> 01:20:46,800
the absolute truth is that aviary was

1586
01:20:52,370 --> 01:20:50,550
was already being circulated and I

1587
01:20:55,850 --> 01:20:52,380
didn't even know I was involved in it

1588
01:20:58,550 --> 01:20:55,860
I honestly god I did not know I was

1589
01:21:01,880 --> 01:20:58,560
involved and I can't really put a finger

1590
01:21:04,729 --> 01:21:01,890
on who started and I I thought it might

1591
01:21:08,560 --> 01:21:04,739
have been Robert Collins but he denies

1592
01:21:12,890 --> 01:21:08,570
it he says it was Jamie and era right or

1593
01:21:14,479 --> 01:21:12,900
for somebody care here but I don't know

1594
01:21:17,570 --> 01:21:14,489
I don't know who started it

1595
01:21:22,520 --> 01:21:17,580
were you involved that were involved

1596
01:21:25,850 --> 01:21:22,530
names were I mean some of them like

1597
01:21:28,060 --> 01:21:25,860
doctor help put off and dr. kik green

1598
01:21:30,590 --> 01:21:28,070
who were very good friends of mine today

1599
01:21:32,660 --> 01:21:30,600
they would call me and say what's this

1600
01:21:34,070 --> 01:21:32,670
Avery saying and I don't know what

1601
01:21:36,530 --> 01:21:34,080
you're talking about it I didn't I

1602
01:21:37,669 --> 01:21:36,540
didn't start it I don't know what so

1603
01:21:43,250 --> 01:21:37,679
somebody else started it

1604
01:21:46,899 --> 01:21:43,260
who was Falcon Falcon the real falcon

1605
01:21:52,910 --> 01:21:46,909
the real real Falcon was Richard Helms

1606
01:22:01,490 --> 01:21:52,920
really ok reaches helm was the real real

1607
01:22:06,620 --> 01:22:01,500
Falcon and to cover him I was was named

1608
01:22:09,140 --> 01:22:06,630
Falcon because Richard Helms was my very

1609
01:22:12,649 --> 01:22:09,150
very very dear friend he was a my father

1610
01:22:14,870 --> 01:22:12,659
was friends of my father's and then of

1611
01:22:16,880 --> 01:22:14,880
course I knew him from that but I became

1612
01:22:20,750 --> 01:22:16,890
friends with him right up until he

1613
01:22:26,149 --> 01:22:20,760
passed away and and and and Richard was

1614
01:22:28,879 --> 01:22:26,159
the he was the real falcon and that's

1615
01:22:31,580 --> 01:22:28,889
been that's not that's that news that

1616
01:22:34,160 --> 01:22:31,590
he's been out for some time it's it's

1617
01:22:37,280 --> 01:22:34,170
been out but I didn't I did not

1618
01:22:38,959 --> 01:22:37,290
know that you and him had that

1619
01:22:40,459 --> 01:22:38,969
relationship that I did know there are

1620
01:22:44,479 --> 01:22:40,469
rumors going on forever

1621
01:22:53,660 --> 01:22:44,489
that dick Helms was was indeed the real

1622
01:22:57,110 --> 01:22:53,670
falcon now well I've said I saw his

1623
01:22:59,780 --> 01:22:57,120
recent interviews that he did the

1624
01:23:02,419 --> 01:22:59,790
there's a documentary out the surviving

1625
01:23:03,919 --> 01:23:02,429
a head of the CIA directors right they

1626
01:23:06,470 --> 01:23:03,929
all get together and talk about the bomb

1627
01:23:10,130 --> 01:23:06,480
I don't know if I have you've seen that

1628
01:23:16,970 --> 01:23:13,220
okay you know again I want to thank you

1629
01:23:19,910 --> 01:23:16,980
I had one more question but I can't I've

1630
01:23:26,360 --> 01:23:19,920
lost it it was in front of me I had one

1631
01:23:29,479 --> 01:23:26,370
more question but Richard I again thank

1632
01:23:31,189 --> 01:23:29,489
you for calling in what we should do

1633
01:23:36,620 --> 01:23:31,199
I mean I was completely unprepared for

1634
01:23:42,200 --> 01:23:36,630
this but if you'd like you knew I was

1635
01:23:45,820 --> 01:23:42,210
calling no no no I no no no no no I got

1636
01:23:50,390 --> 01:23:45,830
a chanst I got a text to look out for

1637
01:23:53,860 --> 01:23:50,400
for numbers your last four that's what I

1638
01:23:56,630 --> 01:23:53,870
got I didn't know I had I had no idea

1639
01:23:59,120 --> 01:23:56,640
and I was told to look out for this

1640
01:24:01,010 --> 01:23:59,130
phone number so no no no absolutely not

1641
01:24:03,380 --> 01:24:01,020
which you know what and that's the

1642
01:24:06,080 --> 01:24:03,390
beauty part of this especially when it's

1643
01:24:07,790 --> 01:24:06,090
live radio if I would have known I would

1644
01:24:11,060 --> 01:24:07,800
have said Richard Odie's calling in

1645
01:24:12,650 --> 01:24:11,070
tonight and I would absolutely not I was

1646
01:24:18,709 --> 01:24:12,660
told to look out for these last four

1647
01:24:22,160 --> 01:24:18,719
digits and there you go so and again

1648
01:24:23,689 --> 01:24:22,170
thank you and let's schedule something

1649
01:24:26,390 --> 01:24:23,699
in in the future

1650
01:24:29,120 --> 01:24:26,400
what you mentioned that you're working

1651
01:24:30,010 --> 01:24:29,130
on the television show or documentary

1652
01:24:32,780 --> 01:24:30,020
what are you doing

1653
01:24:36,580 --> 01:24:32,790
it's a documentary there's gotta love

1654
01:24:41,180 --> 01:24:36,590
them I'm working on that being filmed in

1655
01:24:44,360 --> 01:24:41,190
Nevada in around area 51 any research

1656
01:24:46,160 --> 01:24:44,370
going around it Warm Springs there's

1657
01:24:47,530 --> 01:24:46,170
some things occurring out there that

1658
01:24:50,340 --> 01:24:47,540
there isn't

1659
01:24:52,480 --> 01:24:50,350
mysterious so what you're doing yeah

1660
01:24:54,040 --> 01:24:52,490
sure okay

1661
01:24:55,660 --> 01:24:54,050
all right well good luck with that oh I

1662
01:24:59,170 --> 01:24:55,670
know what my question was it was about

1663
01:25:01,210 --> 01:24:59,180
Bill Cooper it was Bill Cooper and he's

1664
01:25:05,860 --> 01:25:01,220
somebody that I respect he's one of the

1665
01:25:12,340 --> 01:25:05,870
reasons why I do radio today but was he

1666
01:25:15,160 --> 01:25:12,350
an asset no we're not mine okay oh not

1667
01:25:16,690 --> 01:25:15,170
yours so you don't know no no I don't

1668
01:25:19,660 --> 01:25:16,700
know I don't know that it was I don't

1669
01:25:23,440 --> 01:25:19,670
know I have no idea what he was we're

1670
01:25:26,590 --> 01:25:23,450
there okay and was there any influence

1671
01:25:29,710 --> 01:25:26,600
in the media other show hosts or

1672
01:25:35,050 --> 01:25:29,720
television through through the air force

1673
01:25:36,340 --> 01:25:35,060
of the Pentagon on the UFO subject that

1674
01:25:41,200 --> 01:25:36,350
that I was involved with

1675
01:25:43,810 --> 01:25:41,210
I better not answer that what I know is

1676
01:25:47,490 --> 01:25:43,820
I'd better not answer it so the answer

1677
01:25:49,330 --> 01:25:47,500
is yes Oh otherwise you would say no

1678
01:25:52,690 --> 01:25:49,340
okay fair enough

1679
01:25:54,030 --> 01:25:52,700
oh are you under any security agreements

1680
01:26:03,390 --> 01:25:54,040
right now with the Air Force

1681
01:26:14,500 --> 01:26:03,400
no now mine did mine ended in 20 2008

1682
01:26:18,280 --> 01:26:14,510
yeah 2008 2008 and 2008 and well so

1683
01:26:23,320 --> 01:26:18,290
you're retired are you are you receiving

1684
01:26:26,050 --> 01:26:23,330
a retirement pay I'm receiving a young

1685
01:26:28,570 --> 01:26:26,060
saving no it's okay my dad my dad

1686
01:26:30,400 --> 01:26:28,580
retired after 33 years he's getting paid

1687
01:26:33,700 --> 01:26:30,410
I'm so that's why I'm asking

1688
01:26:38,620 --> 01:26:33,710
yeah are you yeah are yes absolutely

1689
01:26:41,110 --> 01:26:38,630
okay are you in jeopardy of though of

1690
01:26:44,500 --> 01:26:41,120
your retirement pay by speaking about

1691
01:26:48,460 --> 01:26:44,510
this kind of stuff on this show yeah

1692
01:26:50,560 --> 01:26:48,470
so you're free to talk no well there are

1693
01:26:52,720 --> 01:26:50,570
things that I won't talk about I mean

1694
01:26:54,970 --> 01:26:52,730
there are things that I did that are

1695
01:26:56,500 --> 01:26:54,980
still probably classified I'm not going

1696
01:26:58,870 --> 01:26:56,510
to talk about it would you talk the

1697
01:27:01,020 --> 01:26:58,880
things that I know that are secretive or

1698
01:27:03,660 --> 01:27:01,030
top-secret or cold word or

1699
01:27:05,970 --> 01:27:03,670
they're very sensitive I'm not going to

1700
01:27:08,700 --> 01:27:05,980
talk about it just talking that I've

1701
01:27:10,170 --> 01:27:08,710
already been on the press I I'm not

1702
01:27:12,450 --> 01:27:10,180
afraid to talk about it would you talk

1703
01:27:19,920 --> 01:27:12,460
to me about it in person or off of the

1704
01:27:25,260 --> 01:27:19,930
air about anything and supposed to say

1705
01:27:27,090 --> 01:27:25,270
yes well no one would be - did we depend

1706
01:27:30,780 --> 01:27:27,100
on the dinner and I don't play around

1707
01:27:34,200 --> 01:27:30,790
when I take somebody out to dinner I bet

1708
01:27:37,560 --> 01:27:34,210
I can promise that - yeah I like seafood

1709
01:27:39,900 --> 01:27:37,570
there you go Richard Doty thank you for

1710
01:27:41,940 --> 01:27:39,910
the surprise call and let's do this

1711
01:27:44,870 --> 01:27:41,950
again and we'll plan it out and we'll

1712
01:27:50,040 --> 01:27:44,880
actually have some structure to it okay

1713
01:27:54,000 --> 01:27:50,050
okay thank you Richard you too you too

1714
01:27:54,870 --> 01:27:54,010
well there you go yes I was completely

1715
01:27:59,970 --> 01:27:54,880
caught by surprise

1716
01:28:02,840 --> 01:27:59,980
and and I think that if anybody here at

1717
01:28:05,640 --> 01:28:02,850
fade to black knew about this in advance

1718
01:28:08,510 --> 01:28:05,650
they are enjoying themselves knowing

1719
01:28:10,800 --> 01:28:08,520
that I was caught completely by surprise

1720
01:28:15,090 --> 01:28:10,810
with that I was told to look out for

1721
01:28:18,030 --> 01:28:15,100
these last four numbers and I I i took

1722
01:28:21,860 --> 01:28:18,040
the call when it when it came in I did

1723
01:28:26,190 --> 01:28:21,870
not know so there you go Richard Doty I

1724
01:28:28,920 --> 01:28:26,200
I was unprepared I hope that for

1725
01:28:30,690 --> 01:28:28,930
everybody here in the fade to black

1726
01:28:33,870 --> 01:28:30,700
audience that happened to listen to this

1727
01:28:36,780 --> 01:28:33,880
live tonight that I asked the questions

1728
01:28:38,730 --> 01:28:36,790
that needed to be asked I've always

1729
01:28:43,950 --> 01:28:38,740
wanted to have the opportunity to

1730
01:28:46,230 --> 01:28:43,960
interview him and I hope that I did I

1731
01:28:48,660 --> 01:28:46,240
hope that I asked the questions wow I'm

1732
01:28:51,200 --> 01:28:48,670
just blown away I'm blown away just like

1733
01:28:53,910 --> 01:28:51,210
everybody else is

1734
01:28:57,390 --> 01:28:53,920
Richard's history his appearance in

1735
01:29:00,420 --> 01:28:57,400
Mirage man I was uncomfortable with he

1736
01:29:02,610 --> 01:29:00,430
was in unacknowledged and I was a little

1737
01:29:08,040 --> 01:29:02,620
bit uncomfortable with that too as well

1738
01:29:10,650 --> 01:29:08,050
and the there's two parts to his past

1739
01:29:15,360 --> 01:29:10,660
there's the urban legend part that has

1740
01:29:17,610 --> 01:29:15,370
been out there where things get things

1741
01:29:20,250 --> 01:29:17,620
get spread around and then there's the

1742
01:29:24,660 --> 01:29:20,260
other part there's the official part and

1743
01:29:27,060 --> 01:29:24,670
that he has always spoken on so what you

1744
01:29:31,530 --> 01:29:27,070
know it what's the real truth and is it

1745
01:29:35,610 --> 01:29:31,540
somewhere down the middle again Richard

1746
01:29:39,170 --> 01:29:35,620
knows that it was his job as he said

1747
01:29:41,070 --> 01:29:39,180
tonight to be a disinformation agent and

1748
01:29:45,330 --> 01:29:41,080
that's what he did

1749
01:29:49,220 --> 01:29:45,340
for he was an agent for the OSI of the

1750
01:29:53,100 --> 01:29:49,230
air force and he worked under orders

1751
01:29:55,770 --> 01:29:53,110
okay that's that's it

1752
01:29:56,250 --> 01:29:55,780
is it an uncomfortable thing yes it is

1753
01:29:59,510 --> 01:29:56,260
for me

1754
01:30:03,450 --> 01:29:59,520
I am completely uncomfortable with it

1755
01:30:05,460 --> 01:30:03,460
completely completely and the other part

1756
01:30:09,210 --> 01:30:05,470
and this is what I stressed with him

1757
01:30:13,020 --> 01:30:09,220
tonight and I'm sure he's listening

1758
01:30:17,610 --> 01:30:13,030
right now which is this kind of stuff

1759
01:30:20,250 --> 01:30:17,620
going on inside of the United States on

1760
01:30:24,420 --> 01:30:20,260
American soil with American citizens is

1761
01:30:26,190 --> 01:30:24,430
a bit funky that's the part I'm just a

1762
01:30:28,620 --> 01:30:26,200
little bit uncomfortable with whether

1763
01:30:31,110 --> 01:30:28,630
they didn't spread disinfo okay well

1764
01:30:33,330 --> 01:30:31,120
that's that's his story and he is gonna

1765
01:30:35,940 --> 01:30:33,340
stick to it and as well he should but

1766
01:30:37,860 --> 01:30:35,950
the other part of it is we're not enemy

1767
01:30:41,910 --> 01:30:37,870
combatants whatever the Air Force wants

1768
01:30:45,840 --> 01:30:41,920
to do with this overseas with in a

1769
01:30:49,350 --> 01:30:45,850
foreign country or you know but here you

1770
01:30:53,270 --> 01:30:49,360
go off of the air force base off of the

1771
01:30:57,060 --> 01:30:53,280
air force base to a civilian gathering

1772
01:30:59,220 --> 01:30:57,070
that's that's that's a bit funky and to

1773
01:31:01,290 --> 01:30:59,230
to have assets reporting back to you

1774
01:31:03,660 --> 01:31:01,300
from inside of these organizations

1775
01:31:06,810 --> 01:31:03,670
that's a bit that's a bit funky to me

1776
01:31:09,480 --> 01:31:06,820
I'm a little bit uncomfortable with it

1777
01:31:11,610 --> 01:31:09,490
and I'm not sure what really is going on

1778
01:31:14,310 --> 01:31:11,620
and I don't know I don't know if we'll

1779
01:31:18,150 --> 01:31:14,320
ever know the truth one thing is for

1780
01:31:20,850 --> 01:31:18,160
sure me asking Richard Doty these

1781
01:31:23,740 --> 01:31:20,860
questions I can't go more direct to the

1782
01:31:27,340 --> 01:31:23,750
source than Richard Doty

1783
01:31:29,620 --> 01:31:27,350
we'll do my best and I think he answered

1784
01:31:32,400 --> 01:31:29,630
he answered everything I gotta give him

1785
01:31:36,160 --> 01:31:32,410
credit for that coming into here

1786
01:31:38,350 --> 01:31:36,170
he's uh he's strong Richard Doty is

1787
01:31:40,540 --> 01:31:38,360
strong all right that concludes another

1788
01:31:44,530 --> 01:31:40,550
week on fade to black

1789
01:31:47,260 --> 01:31:44,540
I I'm taking the weekend off with my

1790
01:31:49,480 --> 01:31:47,270
wife this weekend we are not working we

1791
01:31:52,300 --> 01:31:49,490
work for the last three four weeks in a

1792
01:31:56,530 --> 01:31:52,310
row so there you go we're taking

1793
01:31:58,090 --> 01:31:56,540
tomorrow off thank you thank you Richard

1794
01:31:59,470 --> 01:31:58,100
Doty and you know what didn't have a

1795
01:32:01,330 --> 01:31:59,480
chance to take any phone calls tonight

1796
01:32:04,240 --> 01:32:01,340
well and if I did take a phone call

1797
01:32:06,040 --> 01:32:04,250
thank you paid to Black's executive

1798
01:32:08,740 --> 01:32:06,050
producers Rita Kumari on shows produced

1799
01:32:11,100 --> 01:32:08,750
by Hill J Palmer and Rene Dennis and Bob

1800
01:32:14,560 --> 01:32:11,110
[Music]

1801
01:32:17,350 --> 01:32:14,570
announcers our Steve harder ji botella

1802
01:32:19,450 --> 01:32:17,360
Marty colbaugh webmaster drew the geek

1803
01:32:21,310 --> 01:32:19,460
music doug aldrich intro space boys

1804
01:32:23,290 --> 01:32:21,320
space boy muzac calm

1805
01:32:27,130 --> 01:32:23,300
fade to black is produced by kjsurya

1806
01:32:30,220 --> 01:32:27,140
productions indication is kg ra the

1807
01:32:32,080 --> 01:32:30,230
planet spawn capstone a copyright of

1808
01:32:33,670 --> 01:32:32,090
2017 by paid to black in the game

1809
01:32:35,560 --> 01:32:33,680
changing out war cannot be rebroadcast

1810
01:32:37,270 --> 01:32:35,570
downloaded copied or used anywhere in

1811
01:32:38,680 --> 01:32:37,280
the known universe without written

1812
01:32:40,240 --> 01:32:38,690
permission from fade to black or the

1813
01:32:44,200 --> 01:32:40,250
game changer network i'm your host jimmy